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Locked due to no posts in 60 days. Report 1st post if need unlocked Some stat rankings to chew on

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I believe we've also had a 100+ yard rusher in every game this season except the opener. And, in that game we had a ton of yards by committee. We've also had a couple games with two guys reaching the century mark.

Just another stat to chew on...or tear apart. ;)
 

Some of these issues are whack-a-mole...you fix one, and another pops up. It seems to be a mental consistency issue that needs to be addressed at an overall team level, rather than a position coach or a coordinator...or even a "talent" issue.

Great stuff in general, FLAS - a little objectivity can't hurt anything around here. A small minority of folks try to throw out #'s in the midst of a temper fit, but to view them on the whole is more useful.

I think the "whack-a-mole" analogy is a good one, and also helps explain why this team is so perplexing to some and frustrating to other fans. We can't wrap our heads around exactly what - but it just always seems like something bites us. To me, it almost smells of performance anxiety - happening consistently at a big moment...Where is Jack Stark when we need him? :wow:
 
I believe we've also had a 100+ yard rusher in every game this season except the opener. And, in that game we had a ton of yards by committee. We've also had a couple games with two guys reaching the century mark.

Just another stat to chew on...or tear apart. ;)

I really like the fact this team is one of the nation's top rushing teams. I think they are ranked sixth in the country? I'm surprised that with all the clamoring for the old days when NU beat teams with the run, that this stat hasn't been brought up a whole lot.
 
Anyone who watches entire games and thinks the OL is operating at a high level on a consistent basis is simply seeing what they want to see. Yes, they get the job done at times...but the inexplicable happens WAY too often. Still can't line up right. Centers not snapping the ball. Procedure calls. COmpletely blown assignments. Inability to get short yardage (leading the OC to some weird short yardage calls). Tackles that stand almost no chance against defensive ends. The list goes on.

Despite all that, there are 108 teams that aren't as good as our 'pathetic' offense. So, either you are only using perfection as the standard with which to judge, or you need to accept the fact that EVERY team has flaws and you look at the comparative stats to see how effective you are. I won't argue that there aren't leaks and missed assignments...and guys that just get beat at times...but to think that is only happening here is ludicrous.

Looking at that list, I bet you there are 75+ teams or more that would trade us lock, stock, and barrel for our offensive staff and personnel as it is right now, but nobody close to this situation is being objective enough to see that our offense is better than most of them out there, despite the flaws.

i wouldn't trade our offense or OL coaches for Wisconsin's at this point, and that is the team everyone claimed was so superior to NU in the last 12 months and the most "Nebraska-like". Our "poor" defense dominated them up front. KSU has recruiting rankings in the 60's for the past 4 years, but Snyder is a salty old coach that has a proven system that works there to draw on and a QB that fits it to a T, and is in a league that doesn't play defense to run it. Maybe Snyder's system is better...Oregon's probably is...teams like U$C and the SEC programs have better talent...but if you put us up against our own conference, find me another team that runs AND passes as well as we are this year.
 



I wouldn't want Wisconsin's OL coach either.

And I didn't call NU's offense pathetic. When the OL isn't screwing things up it can be pretty potent. The problem is drive killing penalties, missed assignments, matador routines by tackles, etc. These are things that have been a constant with barney. Not occasional. Constant.

Do you trust NU to pick up 3rd and 1 on a regular basis on the ground? (don't answer that...I wouldn't expect you to acknowledge that you didn't) Apparently, Beck has his doubts.
 
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Great stuff in general, FLAS - a little objectivity can't hurt anything around here. A small minority of folks try to throw out #'s in the midst of a temper fit, but to view them on the whole is more useful.

I think the "whack-a-mole" analogy is a good one, and also helps explain why this team is so perplexing to some and frustrating to other fans. We can't wrap our heads around exactly what - but it just always seems like something bites us. To me, it almost smells of performance anxiety - happening consistently at a big moment...Where is Jack Stark when we need him? :wow:

Well, it's refreshing to know that they're consistent at one aspect of the game.
 
I really like the fact this team is one of the nation's top rushing teams. I think they are ranked sixth in the country? I'm surprised that with all the clamoring for the old days when NU beat teams with the run, that this stat hasn't been brought up a whole lot.

It's not brought up because it doesn't fit the anti-Cotton agenda that seems to permeate the fanbase. People see us win by 1 point to Northwestern and someone's head OBViOUSLY has to roll...why not the guy you have hated on the entire time, even though he's only 50% of the OL staff, isn't on the field during the game in the OL's face, isn't catching punts, isn't fumbling 25 yards downfield after a catch or going left when the play (and all the OL) are going right, etc.. To state that this Ol hasn't improved in the past year, let alone the past five is not only disingenuous, it's flat incorrect. I guess people don't choose to remember how bad this offense was the first 2-3 years under Watson, the constant false start penalties, holding, lack of mobility, terrible blocking schemes/philosophies that were in opposition to each other, guys not playing with effort every play, injuries, fat bodies, etc..

If you look at the 2009 stats, we were top 10 in rushing. That was dismissed because we basically had to shut Lee and Watson's high-risk, low reward offense down and play defense to win games 13-3. I can accept that, especially when our offense couldn't score. However, There is no way in heck you can go through 7 games, be a top 10 rushing offense (behind two service academies and Ga Tech who all run the option heavily) AND be top 15 in scoring, pass efficiency AND total offense without some DAMN GOOD OL play and an OC calling good games. We didn't just RUTS our way against patsies to get to that point. Some need to step back out of their bubble and look at the WHOLE of the offense and its performance to evaluate. There is too much anecdotal extrapolation, too much personal bias, and too much "we aren't perfect, so we SUCK" going on.

are there issues? Yes. There are a helluva lot LESS issues now than even last year or the year before, and it's night/day vs. 4 years ago. The OL has been a legitimate team strength this season, despite losing our best offensive weapon in the run game for the bulk of the season, and if it was as bad as some people claim, we wouldn't have won this many games and we certainly wouldn't have put up 40 points a game or beaten teams like NW or UW. Myopia and angst over close calls and ball security is preventing many from seeing the forest for the trees that sometimes fall in the path, I think.

Plenty to still clean up and we need immediate help at OT, without a doubt, but the incremental improvement I was looking for in each of the past two seasons under Beck and with the addition of Garrison has been happening in front of our eyes. Not all choose to look for positives, however, and choose to just run down every coach and player on our team for no real reason other than to place 'blame' for not being perfect. I understand the frustration, but it is out of hand.
 




I wouldn't want Wisconsin's OL coach either.

And I didn't call NU's offense pathetic. When the OL isn't screwing things up it can be pretty potent. The problem is drive killing penalties, missed assignments, matador routines by tackles, etc. These are things that have been a constant with barney. Not occasional. Constant.

Do you trust NU to pick up 3rd and 1 on a regular basis on the ground? (don't answer that...I wouldn't expect you to acknowledge that you didn't) Apparently, Beck has his doubts.

Pick up 3rd and 1 on a regular basis...now that's funny, I don't care who you are....damn...I'm quoting Larry....how low does it go?
 
It's not brought up because it doesn't fit the anti-Cotton agenda that seems to permeate the fanbase. People see us win by 1 point to Northwestern and someone's head OBViOUSLY has to roll...why not the guy you have hated on the entire time, even though he's only 50% of the OL staff, isn't on the field during the game in the OL's face, isn't catching punts, isn't fumbling 25 yards downfield after a catch or going left when the play (and all the OL) are going right, etc.. To state that this Ol hasn't improved in the past year, let alone the past five is not only disingenuous, it's flat incorrect. I guess people don't choose to remember how bad this offense was the first 2-3 years under Watson, the constant false start penalties, holding, lack of mobility, terrible blocking schemes/philosophies that were in opposition to each other, guys not playing with effort every play, injuries, fat bodies, etc..

If you look at the 2009 stats, we were top 10 in rushing. That was dismissed because we basically had to shut Lee and Watson's high-risk, low reward offense down and play defense to win games 13-3. I can accept that, especially when our offense couldn't score. However, There is no way in heck you can go through 7 games, be a top 10 rushing offense (behind two service academies and Ga Tech who all run the option heavily) AND be top 15 in scoring, pass efficiency AND total offense without some DAMN GOOD OL play and an OC calling good games. We didn't just RUTS our way against patsies to get to that point. Some need to step back out of their bubble and look at the WHOLE of the offense and its performance to evaluate. There is too much anecdotal extrapolation, too much personal bias, and too much "we aren't perfect, so we SUCK" going on.

are there issues? Yes. There are a helluva lot LESS issues now than even last year or the year before, and it's night/day vs. 4 years ago. The OL has been a legitimate team strength this season, despite losing our best offensive weapon in the run game for the bulk of the season, and if it was as bad as some people claim, we wouldn't have won this many games and we certainly wouldn't have put up 40 points a game or beaten teams like NW or UW. Myopia and angst over close calls and ball security is preventing many from seeing the forest for the trees that sometimes fall in the path, I think.

Plenty to still clean up and we need immediate help at OT, without a doubt, but the incremental improvement I was looking for in each of the past two seasons under Beck and with the addition of Garrison has been happening in front of our eyes. Not all choose to look for positives, however, and choose to just run down every coach and player on our team for no real reason other than to place 'blame' for not being perfect. I understand the frustration, but it is out of hand.

I'll go out on that thin limb and say that our offense production this year is all about our awesome receiving corp...they've made everyone's job easier.
 
FLAS-

Nice stats, I agree that things are better than 2008. But, I really wish you would lose the lines like "It's not brought up because it doesn't fit the anti-Cotton agenda," it really cheapens otherwise good posts. This is of course JMO. You know, people can be skeptical of the way things look now without pining for the days of Shawn Watson and Bill Callahan.

Regarding the penalites and turnovers, this is a HUGE problem and it does rest with the coaches, all of them. I don't know what the answer is, but if it continues it will consistently keep NU from winning a lot of games they otherwise could.
 
I'll go out on that thin limb and say that our offense production this year is all about our awesome receiving corp...they've made everyone's job easier.

I love the receivers this team has. WR and RB have been recruited very well IMO. Looks like QB is a strong candidate to add to that list as well with TA and JS (assuming he signs).
 



FLAS-

Nice stats, I agree that things are better than 2008. But, I really wish you would lose the lines like "It's not brought up because it doesn't fit the anti-Cotton agenda," it really cheapens otherwise good posts. This is of course JMO. You know, people can be skeptical of the way things look now without pining for the days of Shawn Watson and Bill Callahan.

Regarding the penalites and turnovers, this is a HUGE problem and it does rest with the coaches, all of them. I don't know what the answer is, but if it continues it will consistently keep NU from winning a lot of games they otherwise could.

Absolutely agreed on the last point. It has and will continue to cost us.

On your editorial comment...if the shoe fits...

Nobody has even MENTIONED that we are a top 6 rushing team all year, have they? I really wonder why. All we've heard for 9 years is "Cotton sucks" from the same crowd and now that we have an offensive identity, a coherent system in place for a second year, two OL coaches, a great stable of backs, and are running the ball as effectively as any non-option based team in the country, there is silence about where our offense ACTUALLY ranks, isn't there?

Our offense is top 15 in the country in passing efficiency, rushing, scoring and total offense and leading the conference...but our OL sucks so bad we should fire, not both, mind you, but just one of the OL coaches? This is a PREPOSTEROUS position to hold unless you have a preconceived bias.

Our OL had nothing to do with us putting three balls on the carpet this weekend, we put up 500 yards of offense and every moron with a keyboard on the interwebz says we should fire the OL coach. Huh? This equation does not add up. There are calls for coaches' jobs going on that make no sense whatsoever, and the pitchfork and torch mob has again chosen their favorite sacrifice to the "we should beat Northwestern by 30, and even though our offense is good we still lost 2 games" god.

Kyler Reed runs the wrong way on 4th down into two linemen and it's Cotton's fAult. Ben Cotton misses a block and it's Barney's fault that there was a sack. (That one has more merit, given the DNA connection...), but these guys are not even in his position group. Hell, he's in the booth and he gets blamed for Sirles and A-Rod not doing the first thing you learn in JR high football, and that's how to line up on the line of scrimmage. (Sirles hitting himself in the helmet on the bench tells me all I need to know about that.) Don't pretend you haven't read these things since Saturday on every forum on the web.

I am NOT saying we are there yet. That's not the case. We aren't yet consistent enough. We need better tackle play, and a few more OT's in our class. We need to do better eliminating penalties, which looked better earlier in the year. Still giving up too many sacks. But we have a physical OL again. We can wear teams out running the ball in the second half again. We can run the damn ball again as a living, not just a hobby between passing plays or defensive series.

Many issues with development and depth were due to having only one practice station with one coach, resulting in lack of reps, lack of depth, plus lack of bodies to begin with. That is still developing and it IS improving. The stats are there. This is the best, most balanced offense we've seen in recent memory, yet there is a whole slew of people chanting "SOMEbody's gotta go" because they are looking for a scapegoat for two losses and a near miss on the road.

Beck doesn't need to be replaced. Neither does Cotton, Garrison, Fisher, or Brown. Our offense is progressing nicely, and is the best it's been for quite sometime. If perfection is the only standard you can compare to, you will hire/fire your way into oblivion. Leave it alone and let it grow. It's now multi-dimensional and attracting talent...as well as winning games instead of trying not to lose them.

Our secondary is back to 2009 stats due to Joseph. Our DL is struggling but hasn't given up under Kaz. Our rush defense is suffering, yes, and that needs more bodies in February to fix. Our baby LB corps needs another year. We still control our own destiny for the conference race and a BCS bowl, so some perspective and sanity is in order, and some comparative statistical looks can help.

If any changes need to be made immediately, it's Els' running ST's. He probably needs to focus on being a LB coach and RC. ST's need to get fixed and we gotta find new ways to recruit and sign talent most effectively. I think he's a good coach, but our ST's are mediocre at best.
 
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If any changes need to be made immediately, it's Els' running ST's. He probably needs to focus on being a LB coach and RC. ST's need to get fixed and we gotta find new ways to recruit and sign talent most effectively. I think he's a good coach, but our ST's are mediocre at best.

Flas, I've really enjoyed this thread. Great job!

I agree about ST. With the intense focus on recruiting, special teams might be one too many areas for one coach, especially since he also has LBs. That's three areas for Els, and three critical areas atm (not that any areas are not important). Could ST be moved to one of the other position coaches? Has Ron Brown ever done anything like that? He's got enough experience coaching I'd think he could do ST without much difficulty. Anybody else though?
 

Absolutely agreed on the last point. It has and will continue to cost us.

On your editorial comment...if the shoe fits...

Nobody has even MENTIONED that we are a top 6 rushing team all year, have they? I really wonder why. All we've heard for 9 years is "Cotton sucks" from the same crowd and now that we have an offensive identity, a coherent system in place for a second year, two OL coaches, a great stable of backs, and are running the ball as effectively as any non-option based team in the country, there is silence about where our offense ACTUALLY ranks, isn't there?

I don't think the shoe fits. That's JMO. Seems the comments bringing up any love for the prior staff always comes from people who are trying to defend Barney or other staff members and not the detractors. Don't get me wrong, I like that you defend them and that your defenses draw on stats and I think that's cool, the constant interjection of PPO and junk like that though makes it seem like you're the one with the agenda. But I think the Barney questioners are people who are generally concerned about not being able to consistently pick up a 3rd and 1 running, the mental mistakes on the line, and IMO the number of times the RB's have to make a great move in the backfield to pick up positive yards. IMO, it has nothing to do with a "prior staff". They may be wrong and that's fine. Like I said, it's possible for someone to disagree with you on this without being a Callahan/Watson lover (are there really any of those people?) or a Solich hater.
 
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