Never Before Told Personal Stories...Thoughts On Tommy Armstrong's Position Change

[wcbsas]

Regarding the "eliteness" of TA's athletisim, your definition is far different than mine. Elite means you are among the very best of the group you are in. In this case it would be NFL players...basically, only the "Pro Bowl" type guys are elite in the NFL...not simply guys signing free agent contracts that aren't likely to make the team and are far less likely to ever play a single down. At the college level, a player would need All-American status, or something close to it to be considered elite. TA isn't close to all-BIG.

"Elite means you are among the very best of the group you are in". TA is battling for an NFL roster spot and is only one of 3,000 on a roster. It takes elite athleticism to be one of the 3,000. The "group" we are talking about is TA the NFL prospect not TA the potential All-Pro. How many kids play college football? How many of those want to play college football.

The 3,000 count is not just college football seniors, it is all returning NFL players from Aaron Rodgers to Tom Brady. It is roughly 300 collegiate seniors vying for jobs against 2,700 returning NFL veterans.

AC above - the former NFL player - agrees on this subject.

 

[ColombianHusker]

EC threw for 7 TDs and threw 10 INT his senior year. His best year was 11-7. TA never had a negative TD/INT ratio. The closest was his freshman year when he was 9-8. His best was 14-8 his senior year. Still not great but better than negative.

let's not start confusing everyone with facts!!

 

[Greatest Fan of All]

"Elite means you are among the very best of the group you are in". TA is battling for an NFL roster spot and is only one of 3,000 on a roster. It takes elite athleticism to be one of the 3,000. The "group" we are talking about is TA the NFL prospect not TA the potential All-Pro. How many kids play college football? How many of those want to play college football.

The 3,000 count is not just college football seniors, it is all returning NFL players from Aaron Rodgers to Tom Brady. It is roughly 300 collegiate seniors vying for jobs against 2,700 returning NFL veterans.

AC above - the former NFL player - agrees on this subject.

The 3000 is the"group" he might make it in, but only a small percentage of those guys are elite athletes...some are good, some are very good, some are exceptional, but very few are great and even fewer are elite. TA could only be considered elite if you were comparing him to the group of all football players over 12 years old, and maybe not even then. He wasn't a 5 star coming out of HS, he wasn't all-american in college, and he isn't going to make the pro bowl, ever.

 

[wcbsas]

The 3000 is the"group" he might make it in, but only a small percentage of those guys are elite athletes...some are good, some are very good, some are exceptional, but very few are great and even fewer are elite. TA could only be considered elite if you were comparing him to the group of all football players over 12 years old, and maybe not even then. He wasn't a 5 star coming out of HS, he wasn't all-american in college, and he isn't going to make the pro bowl, ever.

We have different definitions of the word elite which is fine ... but connecting the term elite athlete to awards such as all-pro, all-American is folly. Justin Tucker was an NFL All-Pro this last season ... by your definition he is an elite athlete.

He may be the most successful, best place kicker in the NFL last season but being All-Pro does not make him an elite athlete. And being an elite athlete does not make someone All-Pro. Clay Matthews, edge rusher for the Packers and JJ Watt D-End for the Texans were not 1st or 2nd team AP All-Pro ... by your definition then they're not elite athlete. And in this case you'd be wrong. You need more than elite athleticism to be an All-Pro - you likely have to be a tireless worker, student of the game, experience, you need to be coachable ... there are plenty of elite athletes who've never been All-Pro or All-American and there have been plenty of All-Pro's and All-Americans who have not been elite athletes.

TA has wonderful athleticism - he's fast, he's strong, he's got decent size, he's got a quick first step, he's got a good body frame ... he's got all of the physical measure-ables that an NFL team would want. Now TA lacks experience as a safety and that is likely going to hinder his NFL career but he's being given a chance because he possesses the physical measure-ables (including elite athleticism) that others do not have.

 

[Adam Carriker]

EC threw for 7 TDs and threw 10 INT his senior year. His best year was 11-7. TA never had a negative TD/INT ratio. The closest was his freshman year when he was 9-8. His best was 14-8 his senior year. Still not great but better than negative.

This adds to my point. EC was clearly not a great passer, yet look what he did in an offense that was suited to him. I still say Tommy and Taylor would have thrived in our old school option offense. Or for Tommy, at least an offense that was better suited or more adjusted for him.

 

[Adam Carriker]

but wouldnt you root for ameer to break the tackle and go for a t.d.GBR.

They are both Huskers, so I always root for both of them. But if I need a tie breaker, I always root for the guy playing defense. As odd as it may sound, if Tommy hits Ameer in an NFL game, that means I'm rooting for Tommy. And man, that does sound weird lol!

 

[Huskerthom]

This adds to my point. EC was clearly not a great passer, yet look what he did in an offense that was suited to him. I still say Tommy and Taylor would have thrived in our old school option offense. Or for Tommy, at least an offense that was better suited or more adjusted for him.

I agree on TA but Taylor was more of a straight line player. TM was in the right offense it is just that he never quite recovered from that injury his freshman year. This caused him to develop that ugly throwing motion which we all saw his last few years. Go back and watch the Mizzou game his FR year. Man that dude was a beast.

 

[Greatest Fan of All]

We have different definitions of the word elite which is fine ... but connecting the term elite athlete to awards such as all-pro, all-American is folly. Justin Tucker was an NFL All-Pro this last season ... by your definition he is an elite athlete.

He may be the most successful, best place kicker in the NFL last season but being All-Pro does not make him an elite athlete. And being an elite athlete does not make someone All-Pro. Clay Matthews, edge rusher for the Packers and JJ Watt D-End for the Texans were not 1st or 2nd team AP All-Pro ... by your definition then they're not elite athlete. And in this case you'd be wrong. You need more than elite athleticism to be an All-Pro - you likely have to be a tireless worker, student of the game, experience, you need to be coachable ... there are plenty of elite athletes who've never been All-Pro or All-American and there have been plenty of All-Pro's and All-Americans who have not been elite athletes.

TA has wonderful athleticism - he's fast, he's strong, he's got decent size, he's got a quick first step, he's got a good body frame ... he's got all of the physical measure-ables that an NFL team would want. Now TA lacks experience as a safety and that is likely going to hinder his NFL career but he's being given a chance because he possesses the physical measure-ables (including elite athleticism) that others do not have.

Goodness, more smoke & mirrors, deflection and strawman arguing than I've seen in any post for a long, long time. Is your name Tommy, or are you dating him? Clearly you are fascinated by him and his obviously superhuman abilities and physique, that few others seem to notice. First, you can't discount all-americans, all-pro's, etc. on the basis of the placekickers and punters, they are obviously not elite athletes but they indeed have elite talents and skills that are all part of reaching a higher level in athletics (getting out of the below mediocre categories). And, basically anyone that's been an all-pro or all-american has earned that title for life, even if they are a 60 pound over-weight Michael Jordan. Running down the real elites in order to "quasi-support" your ideal human being is just sad. It the truth was ever revealed, in IMO it is likely that TA only got re-leased and suspiciously called back by the Vikings as a favor to an NU administrator with lots of pro connections and a certain WR at NU with the same connection. He's a good athlete, not even close to elite in any way, but worse yet...he has no skill sets of any NFL value.

 

[cthusker]

Good grief... IMO some people should lighten up on TA already. He played his guts out for DONU and I hope every Husker fan is thankful and supportative of TA. Tearing the kid down and claiming he has NO skill set of NFL value is off the charts. Unless we have some NFL scouts, coaches, etc posting no one here is qualifed to pass absolute judgement regarding his football skill set.

Bottom line how about everyone giving TA a break and stop ripping this kid apart. Seems nasty for Husker fans to be ragging on him since he's moved on with his football career. I think it's a long shot for him to make the Vikes active roster but then again I remember a 5'10" QB from Kent State the Pats drafted. Anyone want to argue Julian Edelman hasn't turned out to be a pretty fair receiver.

I think all we need do is wish TA the best and leave it at that... Anyway that's how I see it!

 

[Greatest Fan of All]

Good grief... IMO some people should lighten up on TA already. He played his guts out for DONU and I hope every Husker fan is thankful and supportative of TA. Tearing the kid down and claiming he has NO skill set of NFL value is off the charts. Unless we have some NFL scouts, coaches, etc posting no one here is qualifed to pass absolute judgement regarding his football skill set.

Bottom line how about everyone giving TA a break and stop ripping this kid apart. Seems nasty for Husker fans to be ragging on him since he's moved on with his football career. I think it's a long shot for him to make the Vikes active roster but then again I remember a 5'10" QB from Kent State the Pats drafted. Anyone want to argue Julian Edelman hasn't turned out to be a pretty fair receiver.

I think all we need do is wish TA the best and leave it at that... Anyway that's how I see it!

What is his hidden skill set? If my statement is false, then we will be seeing TA in an NFL game some day and I will gladly admit I was wrong. Regarding being "nasty," I tried giving the kid more credit than he deserved, but an insistent poster kept wrongly arguing what an elite athlete he is. Frankly, I would rather never hear the name again, because I don't believe he did anything special at NU or that he was a warrior, or that he played his guts out. I wish him well, but I don't expect it to be playing football anywhere in this country. Thanks for your interest, but not the bothersome and inaccurate scolding. BTW, the thread is about TA and his future...there are many thoughts on the matter and folks like to discuss this stuff as adults, except maybe a few of you who don't join in the discussion but prefer to try to shut down the discussion instead.

 

[wcbsas]

but an insistent poster kept wrongly arguing what an elite athlete he is.

The disagreement you and I have on this point is simply the definition of elite. You'd prefer to not define him as elite because your definition of elite is much tighter than mine. I also believe you are excluding TA from that definition in large part because of a bias you have against TA ... whether it be his performance as a QB these last few years or his recruitment and association with FHCBP.

Webster defines elite as "a select part of a group that is superior to the rest in terms of ability or qualities."

TA is on an NFL roster (a very select group) not because of his experience as a safety but rather his potential which is embolden by his athleticism. He isn't on a 90 man roster because Viking management owe Billy Devaney a favor, he isn't on the roster because there are no better options available. He's on the roster because he has the potential to succeed and that potential is buoyed by his athleticism.

The problem I have with the definition you are using is it is akin to suggesting that TA's athleticism is closer to yours and mine than it is to Harrison Smith the starting safety for the Vikings. I think that perspective undersells and disrespects TA.

 

[cthusker]

What is his hidden skill set? If my statement is false, then we will be seeing TA in an NFL game some day and I will gladly admit I was wrong. Regarding being "nasty," I tried giving the kid more credit than he deserved, but an insistent poster kept wrongly arguing what an elite athlete he is. Frankly, I would rather never hear the name again, because I don't believe he did anything special at NU or that he was a warrior, or that he played his guts out. I wish him well, but I don't expect it to be playing football anywhere in this country. Thanks for your interest, but not the bothersome and inaccurate scolding. BTW, the thread is about TA and his future...there are many thoughts on the matter and folks like to discuss this stuff as adults, except maybe a few of you who don't join in the discussion but prefer to try to shut down the discussion instead.

I'll simply let forum members decide what they believe is fair to TA..... You have your opinion and i have mine. I believe a former Husker (3 year starter) has earned some respect. You don't believe he was a warrior on the field? Really? I'll bet MOST Husker fans believe TA was a warrior regardless of the W-L record.

I believe TA gave 100% for Nebraska football....

 

[Adam Carriker]

I agree on TA but Taylor was more of a straight line player. TM was in the right offense it is just that he never quite recovered from that injury his freshman year. This caused him to develop that ugly throwing motion which we all saw his last few years. Go back and watch the Mizzou game his FR year. Man that dude was a beast.

I agree with that sentiment, that's why he was justifiably dubbed "T-Magic" as a freshman. Don't forget the game he had against Kansas State that year too. I still never liked the plays they were calling for Taylor in that offense. They asked him to pass way too much. We were the only school that offered him as a QB, that's why he came and played for us. I'm just gonna say it, if he could have kept his head on straight (A BIG IF) he would have been a finalist for the Heisman and possibly won it (remember he was on the Heisman watch list a good portion of the season as a freshman), in the old Nebraska offense. Staying healthy would have been key too. He was a straight line player, but don't forget that long run he had against Wisconsin as well, he had just enough wiggle. I know some people will hate what I just wrote and there's A LOT OF IF'S in there, but if a healthy Taylor Martinez keeps his cool, he's in New York in that old Nebraska, smash mouth option offense with just a little help from his team. I believe he was that talented. Look at Robert Griffin, he was a QB on a 10-3 Baylor team and he won it.

 

[berryhusker]

I agree with that sentiment, that's why he was justifiably dubbed "T-Magic" as a freshman. Don't forget the game he had against Kansas State that year too. I still never liked the plays they were calling for Taylor in that offense. They asked him to pass way too much. We were the only school that offered him as a QB, that's why he came and played for us. I'm just gonna say it, if he could have kept his head on straight (A BIG IF) he would have been a finalist for the Heisman and possibly won it (remember he was on the Heisman watch list a good portion of the season as a freshman), in the old Nebraska offense. Staying healthy would have been key too. He was a straight line player, but don't forget that long run he had against Wisconsin as well, he had just enough wiggle. I know some people will hate what I just wrote and there's A LOT OF IF'S in there, but if a healthy Taylor Martinez keeps his cool, he's in New York in that old Nebraska, smash mouth option offense with just a little help from his team. I believe he was that talented. Look at Robert Griffin, he was a QB on a 10-3 Baylor team and he won it.

I agree with you that TM and TA could have been much better in TO's style offense. However, one thing to keep in mind was how dependent those offenses were on the pitching ability running the option; timing, fake pitching, knowing when to keep it. Some QB's have that innate skill to be developed, and some never do to an elite level. Gill, Frazier, and Crouch had that, players like Lord struggled with it. Frost was good but made up for it with his strength in running and better passing ability IMO. It remains to be seen whether TA or TM would have established that, they could have been excellent, we just don't know. Just throwing that out there. I could be off...

 

[Huskerthom]

I agree with you that TM and TA could have been much better in TO's style offense. However, one thing to keep in mind was how dependent those offenses were on the pitching ability running the option; timing, fake pitching, knowing when to keep it. Some QB's have that innate skill to be developed, and some never do to an elite level. Gill, Frazier, and Crouch had that, players like Lord struggled with it. Frost was good but made up for it with his strength in running and better passing ability IMO. It remains to be seen whether TA or TM would have established that, they could have been excellent, we just don't know. Just throwing that out there. I could be off...

I agree with Gill and Frazier. Especially TF that dude seemed to be an inch from his knee touching when he finally pitched it. He also was very good at looking like he was running the option then taking 2 steps back and throwing it down field. EC was the beginning of relying way too much on the QB run under FS. His great running ability bailed us out alot.