Never Before Told Personal Stories...Thoughts On Tommy Armstrong's Position Change

[Red October]

Completely disagree with the bolded. It is not clear that there is ANY pro style offense that TA could succeed in at the division 1 level. MR came here to make Nebraska a championship team again and his plan was to install his offense, not the half-baked offense he had to run with TA and certainly not Beck's offense, or Solich's offense. Had he done that, we'd be so far behind the curve right now that MR would be on the verge of being fired. I can appreciate the fact the MR got pretty much stuck with TA, so I can forgive him for making NU fans put up with 2 years of frustration. Rather than make even more massive changes to accommodate a very mediocre division 1 QB, I'd have preferred he found another athlete to run his offense as designed...we'd be in even better shape than we are now, IMO.

I do not believe there is any offense that TA would succeed in as a QB and that includes a "triple option". You still have to throw the ball and I have yet to see TA successfully pass the football consistently. TA would never have made the 2 deeps on any other team, I wish him well at safety which is where Pelini should have put him.

 

[wcbsas]

Seriously??? The king of the bounce pass.

Compared to the other 3 yes ... Taylor Martinez fashioned his throwing motion from EC. That leaves TF and TA ... yes Scott Frost was a RB or Safety playing QB ... just like all the others but he was once recruited by Bill Walsh to Stanford to compete as a QB ... didn't work out but that should at least be some indication that someone who knows something thought he had potential!

 

[Huskerthom]

Compared to the other 3 yes ... Taylor Martinez fashioned his throwing motion from EC. That leaves TF and TA ... yes Scott Frost was a RB or Safety playing QB ... just like all the others but he was once recruited by Bill Walsh to Stanford to compete as a QB ... didn't work out but that should at least be some indication that someone who knows something thought he had potential!

Walsh actually recruited him and he played as a Safety. BW said he would have the opportunity to play QB then immediately had him play at Safety. Which is why he transferred back to DONU.

 

[wcbsas]

Completely disagree with the bolded. It is not clear that there is ANY pro style offense that TA could succeed in at the division 1 level. MR came here to make Nebraska a championship team again and his plan was to install his offense, not the half-baked offense he had to run with TA and certainly not Beck's offense, or Solich's offense. Had he done that, we'd be so far behind the curve right now that MR would be on the verge of being fired. I can appreciate the fact the MR got pretty much stuck with TA, so I can forgive him for making NU fans put up with 2 years of frustration. Rather than make even more massive changes to accommodate a very mediocre division 1 QB, I'd have preferred he found another athlete to run his offense as designed...we'd be in even better shape than we are now, IMO.

TA wasn't a mediocre D1 QB. He has elite athleticism (NFL-caliber elite albeit at a non-QBing position). He's atop many of the career record books at NU more for his perserverence and longevity than anything but he's no worse of a passing QB than Crouch, Martinez, Lord, Frazier and others of that ilk. The thing everyone of those guys had over TA was a better O-Line and a better running game. If NU could've mounted a better running during the TA era then I think TA would be been more efficient of a throwing QB.

I do fault MR/DL for not making a bolder decision early in his NU career and with a different QB more suited to his offense even if they would've been half the athlete TA was.

 

[ColombianHusker]

I liken TA to Jammal Lord. Extremely athletic and not surrounded by some NUs better teams.

TF and EC were not any better of throwing QBs than TA but they both had much better O-lines and thus running game than TA ever had. I think SF was a better throwing QB than either of the other three.

TA wasn't a mediocre D1 QB. He has elite athleticism (NFL-caliber elite albeit at a non-QBing position). He's atop many of the career record books at NU more for his perserverence and longevity than anything but he's no worse of a passing QB than Crouch, Martinez, Lord, Frazier and others of that ilk. The thing everyone of those guys had over TA was a better O-Line and a better running game. If NU could've mounted a better running during the TA era then I think TA would be been more efficient of a throwing QB.

I do fault MR/DL for not making a bolder decision early in his NU career and with a different QB more suited to his offense even if they would've been half the athlete TA was.

But I think all of the previous greats at Nebraska made better decisions and had a better TD/INT ratio. Although when healthy, TA is a very good runner. He would have done well in a Wishbone style offense.

 

[cthusker]

I liken TA to Jammal Lord. Extremely athletic and not surrounded by some NUs better teams.

TF and EC were not any better of throwing QBs than TA but they both had much better O-lines and thus running game than TA ever had. I think SF was a better throwing QB than either of the other three.

I tend to agree except TA seemed to make lots of poor decisions passing which led to turnovers. None of the QB's listed possessed what I'd call great throwing mechanics. None were going to be QB's in NFL IMO including TF.

Bottom line in days past TO wanted different skill sets then say MR does now. We should have a fun time watching what transpires this season.....

 

[Huskerthom]

But I think all of the previous greats at Nebraska made better decisions and had a better TD/INT ratio. Although when healthy, TA is a very good runner. He would have done well in a Wishbone style offense.

EC threw for 7 TDs and threw 10 INT his senior year. His best year was 11-7. TA never had a negative TD/INT ratio. The closest was his freshman year when he was 9-8. His best was 14-8 his senior year. Still not great but better than negative.

 

[Greatest Fan of All]

TA wasn't a mediocre D1 QB. He has elite athleticism (NFL-caliber elite albeit at a non-QBing position). He's atop many of the career record books at NU more for his perserverence and longevity than anything but he's no worse of a passing QB than Crouch, Martinez, Lord, Frazier and others of that ilk. The thing everyone of those guys had over TA was a better O-Line and a better running game. If NU could've mounted a better running during the TA era then I think TA would be been more efficient of a throwing QB.

I do fault MR/DL for not making a bolder decision early in his NU career and with a different QB more suited to his offense even if they would've been half the athlete TA was.

No he wasn't, I was being kind. You seem to equate being a good athlete at being good at a position. TA was incapable of learning and effectively executing the skill sets and pro-style offensive scheme of a division 1 QB. It is that simple. BTW, TA's athleticism is definitely NOT elite, it is good...perhaps even very good, but not close to elite.

 

[Greatest Fan of All]

Seriously??? The king of the bounce pass.

Remind me again how you never "bash" NU players or ex-players.

 

[Red October]

TA wasn't a mediocre D1 QB. He has elite athleticism (NFL-caliber elite albeit at a non-QBing position). He's atop many of the career record books at NU more for his perserverence and longevity than anything but he's no worse of a passing QB than Crouch, Martinez, Lord, Frazier and others of that ilk. The thing everyone of those guys had over TA was a better O-Line and a better running game. If NU could've mounted a better running during the TA era then I think TA would be been more efficient of a throwing QB.

I do fault MR/DL for not making a bolder decision early in his NU career and with a different QB more suited to his offense even if they would've been half the athlete TA was.

TA was all the great Pelini left NU to work with. It also remains to be seen if he can even make the Viking team.

 

[cthusker]

EC threw for 7 TDs and threw 10 INT his senior year. His best year was 11-7. TA never had a negative TD/INT ratio. The closest was his freshman year when he was 9-8. His best was 14-8 his senior year. Still not great but better than negative.

I think it's all about WHEN he threw those INT's...............

 

[Huskerthom]

Remind me again how you never "bash" NU players or ex-players.

LOL I deserve that one.

 

[Adam Carriker]

IMO, Tommy Armstrong would have done well in the old school Nebraska offense or an offense like what Georgia Tech runs. Tommie Frazier and Scott Frost were great college QB's, but neither one threw very well. Imagine either one of them in MR current offense throwing the ball anywhere from 30-50 times a game at times.

TA is also to blame though as well. He has a better arm than either Frazier or Frost (I've seen Frost need a cut off man once he got to 50 yards when he challenged me to a throwing competition). TA did not make enough progress from his Frosh to senior seasons. Never doubted his heart or toughness though.

Tommy is an elite athlete. It appeared to me that MR and DL wanted to give the appearance of molding the offense around Tommy, but anytime push came to shove in the slightest, they ran away from that and back to what they knew as coaches, not what was best for the players.

As far as MR coming here to run his offense and not some half baked version of it with Tommy, to me that means he basically sacrificed the last two seasons, at least to some sort of a degree. There have been plenty teams who've called an offense around a pocket passer and a mobile QB as well. MR's lack of ability to consistently do this the past 2 season's (in particular when things got tough) is actually the biggest question mark I have about him. His ability to adapt as a coach. Look at Nick Saban, he's running a completely different offense now. I understand he's a defensive coach, but you get my point. Had Osborne not had that ability to adapt, we probably wouldn't have had a National Title in '94, IMHO.

 

[wcbsas]

No he wasn't, I was being kind. You seem to equate being a good athlete at being good at a position. TA was incapable of learning and effectively executing the skill sets and pro-style offensive scheme of a division 1 QB. It is that simple. BTW, TA's athleticism is definitely NOT elite, it is good...perhaps even very good, but not close to elite.

According to NCAA.Org of the 109 FBS players who qualified for the passing efficiency title TA finished 77th with a 123.9 passer efficiency rating. The mean rating was 135.5 which means TA was in the 3rd quartile but not THAT far off of an mean or average performance.

Such notables who finished worse than TA in passer rating was Taysom Hill of BYU - currently on the Packers roster, Mitch Leidner, Trevor Knight of aTm, David Blough from Purdue. Other notables above TA slightly are/were David Webb of Call (52nd) who was drafted and JT Barrett of tOSU (55th). Hardly horrible. Not B1G championship caliber or NC caliber but not bad either. We both agree it needs to be better and we both agree TA wasn't probably going to get to the level necessary either!

Yes TA's athleticism is elite. He's currently one of only 3,000 athletes on an NFL roster (1,920 make an NFL roster). That is pretty elite regardless of anyone's math!

 

[Greatest Fan of All]

According to NCAA.Org of the 109 FBS players who qualified for the passing efficiency title TA finished 77th with a 123.9 passer efficiency rating. The mean rating was 135.5 which means TA was in the 3rd quartile but not THAT far off of an mean or average performance.

Such notables who finished worse than TA in passer rating was Taysom Hill of BYU - currently on the Packers roster, Mitch Leidner, Trevor Knight of aTm, David Blough from Purdue. Other notables above TA slightly are/were David Webb of Call (52nd) who was drafted and JT Barrett of tOSU (55th). Hardly horrible. Not B1G championship caliber or NC caliber but not bad either. We both agree it needs to be better and we both agree TA wasn't probably going to get to the level necessary either!

Yes TA's athleticism is elite. He's currently one of only 3,000 athletes on an NFL roster (1,920 make an NFL roster). That is pretty elite regardless of anyone's math!

Funny stuff. You start by pointing out that TA indeed WAS below average in passing statistics, which means exactly as I stated, I was being kind to TA by saying he was mediocre. But, then you point out that there were some "notables" that were above, and even a few below, TA's passing stats? Who cares? I don't follow their teams and am unfamiliar with whether they are as lousy at passing as TA is, or not. I do believe a few of these other "notables" might get drafted or make a team at QB because they understand pro-style schemes and can be taught to go through progressions, not panic in the pocket and/or otherwise can actually run a pro-style offense, something that is of value in the NFL. TA simply can not.

Regarding the "eliteness" of TA's athletisim, your definition is far different than mine. Elite means you are among the very best of the group you are in. In this case it would be NFL players...basically, only the "Pro Bowl" type guys are elite in the NFL...not simply guys signing free agent contracts that aren't likely to make the team and are far less likely to ever play a single down. At the college level, a player would need All-American status, or something close to it to be considered elite. TA isn't close to all-BIG.