Time to talk a little sheme and dream

[Huskerthom]

Directing this to a few folks that seem to know what they are talking about. @ShortSideOption @Middle-aged_Ball_Coach @Red Reign and any others that have been coaches and or [played at a high level.

One of the most frustrating things for me to watch this year was the constant reliance on zone coverage and or playing off of WR. Let me start with a few times I understood this.

1. When we played OSU we were playing to slow them down rather than stop them. We did not have the horses to play their WRs man up.
2. This may even be true with individual players like Illini kid Materbaebae. Probably spelled that last one wrong.

I actually believe this led to a few of our losses. Minnesota and North western in particular come to mind. Where us playing soft coverage allowed them to get a few 1st downs at key moments in the game. I realize our O did not perform well in these games either. However we always left our self with long fields.

 

[Husker Country Doc]

Why the obsession with Chinander and the defense?!?

I've NO BONE to pick with the defense this year, unless you wanted them to play offense, too.

EVERYTHING that was wrong with this team, this year, is on the offense. More points, more wins.

(not absolving the ST's, but better offensive play would've negated the ST's mistakes)

 

[Huskerthom]

Why the obsession with Chinander and the defense?!?

I've NO BONE to pick with the defense this year, unless you wanted them to play offense, too.

EVERYTHING that was wrong with this team, this year, is on the offense. More points, more wins.

(not absolving the ST's, but better offensive play would've negated the ST's mistakes)

I never mentioned Chinander and I fully admit that our D was better this year than previous years. I am questioning ONE aspect of the defense. You can admit improvement and still look at areas of improvement.

 

[Frosty1980]

Why the obsession with Chinander and the defense?!?

I've NO BONE to pick with the defense this year, unless you wanted them to play offense, too.

EVERYTHING that was wrong with this team, this year, is on the offense. More points, more wins.

(not absolving the ST's, but better offensive play would've negated the ST's mistakes)

I don’t thing he’s wrong here. I’m very pleased with the defense but asked the same questions during the season. The zone coverage got picked apart. Thought we should have locked up man to man with our supposedly great defensive backfield. Other than Cam I’m not impressed with our DB’s.

 

[Frosty1980]

I never mentioned Chinander and I fully admit that our D was better this year than previous years. I am questioning ONE aspect of the defense. You can admit improvement and still look at areas of improvement.

I understand what you’re saying. Definitely have the same questions. Hopefully some more knowledgeable posters will weigh in.

 

[dnyelator]

So I've not coached or played beyond HS ball, and I'm not one of the three you called out, but I did stay in a Holiday Inn and had the privilege of watching 4 years of practice under Bo. In 2009, with Marvin Sanders as secondary coach, many of you know we had the #1 ranked pass defense, intercepted 18 passes and only allowed 7 TD passes. Marvin challenged his corners every practice to play physical at the line. He drilled it over and over. One particular day, a corner got beat off the line and when it was over he coached the player up good and then said run it again. He got beat again. Marvin said "get me another corner, run it again". So they did and the corner got beat. Marvin said "get me another corner...run it again"....and no kidding, he got beat. Marvin says "so help me God, I'm going to find me a corner, get me another corner and run it again". I had to hide my laughter. Then the next day, the starting corner was so physical during a scrimmage that he got into it with the starting WR, and a couple of players had to step in and separate them. That corner has played 10 years in the league. And while I'm at it, Marvin also told the safeties on third and long that he wanted them so deep that they didn't even show up on the practice tape. So obviously we play it alot differently now by playing off the WRs, but I still think coaching has alot to do with it, not just the talent level.

 

[DuckTownHusker]

So I've not coached or played beyond HS ball, and I'm not one of the three you called out, but I did stay in a Holiday Inn and had the privilege of watching 4 years of practice under Bo. In 2009, with Marvin Sanders as secondary coach, many of you know we had the #1 ranked pass defense, intercepted 18 passes and only allowed 7 TD passes. Marvin challenged his corners every practice to play physical at the line. He drilled it over and over. One particular day, a corner got beat off the line and when it was over he coached the player up good and then said run it again. He got beat again. Marvin said "get me another corner, run it again". So they did and the corner got beat. Marvin said "get me another corner...run it again"....and no kidding, he got beat. Marvin says "so help me God, I'm going to find me a corner, get me another corner and run it again". I had to hide my laughter. Then the next day, the starting corner was so physical during a scrimmage that he got into it with the starting WR, and a couple of players had to step in and separate them. That corner has played 10 years in the league. And while I'm at it, Marvin also told the safeties on third and long that he wanted them so deep that they didn't even show up on the practice tape. So obviously we play it alot differently now by playing off the WRs, but I still think coaching has alot to do with it, not just the talent level.

There have been some flashes of elite secondary play in the last handful of years, but it's not like those 2008-2010 era backfields with guys like Amukamara, Dennard, Hagg and others. We had a level of physical play that was intense.

Also, remember that during those stretches we were playing against QBs like Colt McCoy, Sam Bradford, Graham Harrell, Todd Reesing, Brandon Weeden and a bunch of Gabberts at Mizzou. Teams like OU, UT, Tech and even Mizzou and Kansas for the bit were cranking out passing yards like nobody's business. The Big XII at the time had some of the deepest passing QBs in the country and we were shutting them down week-in and week-out.

 

[ksuhusker]

Directing this to a few folks that seem to know what they are talking about. @ShortSideOption @Middle-aged_Ball_Coach @Red Reign and any others that have been coaches and or [played at a high level.

One of the most frustrating things for me to watch this year was the constant reliance on zone coverage and or playing off of WR. Let me start with a few times I understood this.

1. When we played OSU we were playing to slow them down rather than stop them. We did not have the horses to play their WRs man up.
2. This may even be true with individual players like Illini kid Materbaebae. Probably spelled that last one wrong.

I actually believe this led to a few of our losses. Minnesota and North western in particular come to mind. Where us playing soft coverage allowed them to get a few 1st downs at key moments in the game. I realize our O did not perform well in these games either. However we always left our self with long fields.

My son has a major issue with this as well, we seemed to have the talent to match up and shut great wide outs down, see Purdue.

 

[SavageHusker]

So I've not coached or played beyond HS ball, and I'm not one of the three you called out, but I did stay in a Holiday Inn and had the privilege of watching 4 years of practice under Bo. In 2009, with Marvin Sanders as secondary coach, many of you know we had the #1 ranked pass defense, intercepted 18 passes and only allowed 7 TD passes. Marvin challenged his corners every practice to play physical at the line. He drilled it over and over. One particular day, a corner got beat off the line and when it was over he coached the player up good and then said run it again. He got beat again. Marvin said "get me another corner, run it again". So they did and the corner got beat. Marvin said "get me another corner...run it again"....and no kidding, he got beat. Marvin says "so help me God, I'm going to find me a corner, get me another corner and run it again". I had to hide my laughter. Then the next day, the starting corner was so physical during a scrimmage that he got into it with the starting WR, and a couple of players had to step in and separate them. That corner has played 10 years in the league. And while I'm at it, Marvin also told the safeties on third and long that he wanted them so deep that they didn't even show up on the practice tape. So obviously we play it alot differently now by playing off the WRs, but I still think coaching has alot to do with it, not just the talent level.

Marvin was a phenomenal coach. He’s proving it again.

 

[NorthwoodHusker]

There have been some flashes of elite secondary play in the last handful of years, but it's not like those 2008-2010 era backfields with guys like Amukamara, Dennard, Hagg and others. We had a level of physical play that was intense.

Also, remember that during those stretches we were playing against QBs like Colt McCoy, Sam Bradford, Graham Harrell, Todd Reesing, Brandon Weeden and a bunch of Gabberts at Mizzou. Teams like OU, UT, Tech and even Mizzou and Kansas for the bit were cranking out passing yards like nobody's business. The Big XII at the time had some of the deepest passing QBs in the country and we were shutting them down week-in and week-out.

Not to change the subject, but once transitioning to the Big, howd the run game D go?
IOW, didnt the pass game get worse too?
Did we have guys able to get to the qb, etc.

Theres more to it, a better question would be,did we use to mix zone with disguised man or vise versa.

 

[Huskerthom]

Not to change the subject, but once transitioning to the Big, howd the run game D go?
IOW, didnt the pass game get worse too?
Did we have guys able to get to the qb, etc.

Theres more to it, a better question would be,did we use to mix zone with disguised man or vise versa.

I think one of the reasons we did not get to the QB as often as we liked. Was that we played so far off. If a QB can throw the ball 5 yards on almost every play without worrying about a DB being there. Than there is not time for the Dline to get to him. If you bump the WR well on the line it takes them a second or two to get into their pattern. That means the Dline is already half way there.

 

[cthusker]

One issue I was disappointed in was 3rd down conversation against our D. In 2019 we ranked 10th in the conference and in 2020 we ranked 10th in the conference!! So we did some good things on D but stopping 3rd down conversations wasn't one of them. We consistently give up big yds on 3rd down when it's needed by our opponents. That needs to improve a lot if our D is going get some rest and let our offense back on the field. Probably meshes up with our DB's playing to far off WR's.

 

[Walztrent]

One issue I was disappointed in was 3rd down conversation against our D. In 2019 we ranked 10th in the conference and in 2020 we ranked 10th in the conference!! So we did some good things on D but stopping 3rd down conversations wasn't one of them. We consistently give up big yds on 3rd down when it's needed by our opponents. That needs to improve a lot if our D is going get some rest and let our offense back on the field. Probably meshes up with our DB's playing to far off WR's.

I think they went into conservative mode on the long third down plays. They tried the bend but don’t break strategy from what I noticed.

 

[cthusker]

I think they went into conservative mode on the long third down plays. They tried the bend but don’t break strategy from what I noticed.

I agree. You can't back off receivers for 12 yds when they need only 8 or 9 for a FD. The way to stop that stuff is to either blitz (and get home) or start playing receivers a lot tighter. Simply can't concede the yardage and hope to make a quick stop before it's picked up.

 

[lo country]

IIRC, Sanders had 3 rules for the CB's. Knock them down at the LOS, knock them off their route or knock them out of bounds....All 3 would result in no opportunities to catch a ball. I am hoping that Chin and Co will start to play more press once the D gets the experience that it appears we will have next year. Those years mentioned above, we had some very good DB's.....Against some very good QB's....