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The roster flip

***, always appreciate you providing details to support your topics for discussion and not just ranting, bitching, complaining or whatever so many seem to like to do on the boards.
I'm going to be real curious what happens with guys like Avery Roberts, Guy Thomas, and WIllie Hampton. Avery Roberts is leading Oregon State in tackles right now, it's clear he can play, and we may have just not pressed the right buttons with him. That's why I think we had an unnecessary amount of roster flip that is causing our hurdles right now. Would be nice to have him to get in there on these 3rd down crossing routes that Barry and Honas can't cover. He was by far the most athletic guy we had at ILB.
 
I'm going to be real curious what happens with guys like Avery Roberts, Guy Thomas, and WIllie Hampton. Avery Roberts is leading Oregon State in tackles right now, it's clear he can play, and we may have just not pressed the right buttons with him. That's why I think we had an unnecessary amount of roster flip that is causing our hurdles right now. Would be nice to have him to get in there on these 3rd down crossing routes that Barry and Honas can't cover. He was by far the most athletic guy we had at ILB.
Do we see a change at either/both LB coaching spot for next year?
 
Only way we lose Ruud is to a defensive coordinator promotion. Not sure on Dewitt, been a rough 12 months for him.
Ruud that good? Recruiting well?

Dewitt's had a horrible past year and I wish him nothing but the best. I'm not sure he's cut out at this point in his life for the job though.
 



Maybe it's having some good talent that stays healthy and then coupling that with playing a weak schedule that creates and allows for confidence to build, moral to remain high and then being able to get up for a big game in a bowl. Maybe that's the secret formula..? How many teams on their schedule the year were really better than Purdue, Illinois etc?
 
Ruud that good? Recruiting well?

Dewitt's had a horrible past year and I wish him nothing but the best. I'm not sure he's cut out at this point in his life for the job though.
I know Ruud is really highly thought of. Frost basically had to make a spot for him (got lucky with the additional assistant) or he was more than likely going to lose him to somewhere else.

He pulled in arguably the best position class for 2019 with Nick Henrich, Jackson Hannah, Garrett Snodgrass, then flipping a walk-on from South Dakota State to us that is actually looking like the best of the bunch right now. With that said, he's sitting at zero commits for 2020 and it's a massive position of need.

Dewitt is pretty much blanked this year when you think about it, because Chinander reeled in Gunnerson for him. And I don't know if he really helped land anyone in the 2019 class that wasn't already coming? But that would be @N2FL expertise to speak about.
 
I'm going to be real curious what happens with guys like Avery Roberts, Guy Thomas, and WIllie Hampton. Avery Roberts is leading Oregon State in tackles right now, it's clear he can play, and we may have just not pressed the right buttons with him. That's why I think we had an unnecessary amount of roster flip that is causing our hurdles right now. Would be nice to have him to get in there on these 3rd down crossing routes that Barry and Honas can't cover. He was by far the most athletic guy we had at ILB.

I watched Oregon State play a few weeks ago. Roberts can play. We could use him right now.
 
I watched Oregon State play a few weeks ago. Roberts can play. We could use him right now.
I agree. And I also understand from the staffs perspective that if the kid isn't responding to you, or it's just not a great fit, it's time to part ways. I just think they made their bed a bit here and it's not Riley's fault, it's the bravado they came in with (rarely is confidence a bad thing).

If we are going to use the "need to change the culture" or "we are young" or "we need more of our guys" narrative, go all in with it. Don't say those things to me and add "get us now because we will be dangerous in 2019" then start Jack Stoll, Kade Warner, Brendan Jaimes, Boe Wilson, Matt Farniok, JD Spielman, Khalil Davis, Carlos Davis, Mo Barry, Collin Miller, JoJo Domann, Alex Davis, Lamar Jackson, Dicaprio Bootle, and Marquel Dismuke from the staff and culture you are blaming things on.

So i'm clear, JD Spielman and Mo Barry don't have a culture or attitude issue IMO and aren't the problem, but what i'm getting at is don't use that as a reason then continue to trot the reason onto the field every Saturday. I truly think that's where a lot of the frustration comes from. If I told you on Monday a lot of my problems come from alcohol (culture problem not having his guys), and then say "weekend plans are the same, heading to multiple bars" (depth chart stays same with non-Frost guys) how much would you take me serious?
 
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1. Scott at UCF was very similar to The Bob Father at DONU in 1963. He inherits a team with talent that is under motivated and under coached in a league (AAC similar to Big 8) that is relatively easy to win. Then he presents them with an offensive system that is difficult to counter and a Heisman Trophy caliber QB to run it. (Milton vs Claridge: Dr Tom once said that Claridge was maybe as talented a QB as ever played at DONU, just didnt play in a system that showed it).

2. Coming here he found athletes that have played under multiple coaches and systems, no unifying direction in their collegiate careers except for one thing: losing!
The review of the defense by Hail Varsity today will make you want to cry in that in week 9, the defense still is not communicating even at a high school level. So LB's running a 4.3 won't get you anywhere if they cant learn who to cover 3/4 of the way through the season :(.
Our coaches must be so embarrassed thinking of the other teams laughing when they show our tapes to their offense.
DC Chin cant scheme when his players cant remember who their guys are and where they are supposed to go! ***, did you and your friends talk about this and what if anything you would do?

3. Historically Fleck is making a mistake playing all those freshman. One big year does not a future make.

It increases the chance for injury (they already lost their starting QB for the year) because freshman often aren't ready for Big Ten football.

DONU knows from experience that linemen benefit from physical maturity and S&C from the RS year.

And in the "modern era" players don't stay around for 4 and 5 years. They leave for the pros (see th DE for Ohio State, he is too good to play four years in college) or if they don't play a lot right away they hit the Transfer Portal.

RS players usually know why they are sitting out a year and have agreed to that plan for their future, especially with the four game rule.

GBR
Yeah the Big 8 was real easy to win in as the 71 season shows. The top three teams in the country were from the Big 8.
 
1. Scott at UCF was very similar to The Bob Father at DONU in 1963. He inherits a team with talent that is under motivated and under coached in a league (AAC similar to Big 8) that is relatively easy to win. Then he presents them with an offensive system that is difficult to counter and a Heisman Trophy caliber QB to run it. (Milton vs Claridge: Dr Tom once said that Claridge was maybe as talented a QB as ever played at DONU, just didnt play in a system that showed it).

2. Coming here he found athletes that have played under multiple coaches and systems, no unifying direction in their collegiate careers except for one thing: losing!
The review of the defense by Hail Varsity today will make you want to cry in that in week 9, the defense still is not communicating even at a high school level. So LB's running a 4.3 won't get you anywhere if they cant learn who to cover 3/4 of the way through the season :(.
Our coaches must be so embarrassed thinking of the other teams laughing when they show our tapes to their offense.
DC Chin cant scheme when his players cant remember who their guys are and where they are supposed to go! ***, did you and your friends talk about this and what if anything you would do?

3. Historically Fleck is making a mistake playing all those freshman. One big year does not a future make.

It increases the chance for injury (they already lost their starting QB for the year) because freshman often aren't ready for Big Ten football.

DONU knows from experience that linemen benefit from physical maturity and S&C from the RS year.

And in the "modern era" players don't stay around for 4 and 5 years. They leave for the pros (see th DE for Ohio State, he is too good to play four years in college) or if they don't play a lot right away they hit the Transfer Portal.

RS players usually know why they are sitting out a year and have agreed to that plan for their future, especially with the four game rule.

GBR
Yeah the Big 8 was real easy to win in as the 71 season shows. The top three teams in the country were from the Big 8.
 
Yeah the Big 8 was real easy to win in as the 71 season shows. The top three teams in the country were from the Big 8.

Yes, that included DONU of course :). The 1971 year was an aberration, the only time it has ever happened.

None of the other Big 8 teams were ranked in 1971.

The Big 8 was DONU, Oklahoma and then someone else. Some years it was Mizzou, others Kansas (1968 Champs) then Colorado in 1970.

But ISU, KSU, and OSU were not contenders in the Devaney era.

This is very similar to the AAC when Scott was there, a few good team at the top but the rest were teams that you could be pretty sure you were going to beat.
 
Yes, that included DONU of course :). The 1971 year was an aberration, the only time it has ever happened.

None of the other Big 8 teams were ranked in 1971.

The Big 8 was DONU, Oklahoma and then someone else. Some years it was Mizzou, others Kansas (1968 Champs) then Colorado in 1970.

But ISU, KSU, and OSU were not contenders in the Devaney era.

This is very similar to the AAC when Scott was there, a few good team at the top but the rest were teams that you could be pretty sure you were going to beat.
So 25% of the conference was top 10 every year and in many years 3/8 or 50% of the conference was top 25. That's pretty good.
 



Thats interesting. The flip side to that is what about the leaders of the team and the qualities of those players? Mike Hughes was a first round pick - we don't have one of those but maybe LJax will get taken higher than expected. Trysten Hill was a 2nd round pick - we don't have a DT making that type of impact. Shaquem Griffin (5th round pick) compared to ??? Mo Barry maybe? Tre'Quan Smith (3rd round pick) compared to our best WR in Stanley was an UFA. Jordan Akins was also a 3rd round pick.

So perhaps the quality of depth wasn't as good, so younger players could come in and make a more immediate impact at UCF, but the top of the our roster doesn't quite have the same level of talent? With players of that caliber, internal leadership maybe was less of an issue? Add to that a QB who made noticeable progress? If Martinez would be putting up numbers comparable to what Milton did his sophomore year, we'd be looking at this year much differently.

While this is certainly true, if those numbers were there, it would necessarily mean that the WR position was producing big time. Also, 2nd year at UCF they had 2-3 studs running and catching out of the RB spot, where currently it just isn't happening. I'm sorry, as much as everyone likes Mazour and Belt, they are not Killians.
 
***
I do not want to break up the staff for recruiting reasons and because staff continuity is one of the hallmarks of "The Nebraska Way" that Scott is trying to bring back (and rightfully so, its critical to our long term success).

However, the slowness of development of success at DONU begs the issue of outside analysts to help Scott identify things that could be done better with the players on hand in addition to the recruiting efforts he and his staff are making for the December deadline.

Have you and your "friends" discussed this?
Do you think that AD Moos and Scott's staff have thought about getting analysts in here?

Thanks

GBR

And yet, it is the same coaches who developed players quickly at UCF. At some point it comes down to the players. An earlier post asked why the Davis twins couldn't be developed. I think that is a great question, best answered by the Davis twins. I have noticed at times this year that they can be pretty undisciplined (past crucial penalties being one indicator), and if we want to branch out, JJD admitted he "tried to make a play" instead of doing his job on the Purdue TD. Sometimes, when coaches don't get the same results as in the past, you have to look at the differences in the players they are coaching. I doubt the coaches forgot how to "develop" in 2 years.
 

I do not understand why some RB buried in the depth chart are not trying out at LB.

The failure rate of position switches is very high. There will be examples of it working, but for every one of those, there will be 5+ where the player didn't contribute at the new position either.
 

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