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Another Martinez Thread

Red October

Junior Varsity
5 Year Member
One of AM's biggest problems is that Frost oversold him. Remember, we had just witnessed a miracle season led by Frost at UCF led by a high powered, up-tempo offense. Frost practically boasted that he was going to bring that Formula 1 to NU and Martinez was going to be his driver--the next McKenzie Milton. Expectations were high and after AM's first year, most people (myself excluded) were convinced he was The One and after a couple of years experience was going to be a bona fide star QB. For whatever reason, AM never took off his 2nd year, had a ho-hum 3rd year and has consequently failed to meet some pretty high expectations since that first promising season.

Frost needs to temper his comments about incoming players and talk about all recruits/signees/current players with equal enthusiasm.

(Sidebar: I suspect injury was in large part AM's problem in 2020 and will be in the future as well. I b elieve he's injury prone. Hard to know for sure since Frost is quiet regarding injuries.)
The big trouble with Frost is that he has oversold everything about our program. The expectations created in his first appearances have led to disappointment of the fans through no fault of their own. I get it that we want to hear great or good news, but fake news is not the answer.
 

RedSaidTed

Red Shirt
Getting a lot of wins will take time, in the sense that this team needs to learn to win, and then be confident in doing so.
Looking at the MR team what went 7-0, the fan base and the players werent confident and werent ready for that next step, and the rest is history.
At UCF, the surrounding team was mostly the same,and they learned year one to win, and as MM had a little playing time, well, adding it all up, throw in a few good recruits, that too was history.

But, as you said, they still needed that MM level of play
They have had three years to learn to win. If they don’t win in 2021 it’s likely over for this staff. The fan base isn’t going to be okay with 5 losing seasons in a row, 4 in a row for this staff. And if Frost has 4 losing seasons in a row you can expect recruiting to drop off significantly. This is a make or break season for Frost and company. I think they get at least 6 wins, maybe 7 and show significant progress on the field. That’s why I think it’s critical that they have a really solid plan B at QB in the event that Martinez struggles. There is zero margin for error.
 

Red October

Junior Varsity
5 Year Member
I think I disagree with all of this except the part about being promised he’d be a 4 year starter. I agree that whole line of thought is crap.

As for Martinez, he has not been good for the past two seasons. Some will argue he had a good competition percentage in 2020 and that’s true and gives me some hope, but his inability to get the ball downfield hurt this offense. Some will say that was on the WRs and we certainly didn’t have great deep threats but when we did have guys open downfield he missed them, either visually or physically. That said, my hope is he will spend the off season working on that part of his game and he will certainly benefit from the bigger receivers he will have available in 2021. That alone will improve this offense.

The other problem I’ve had with Martinez that boggles my mind is that he doesn’t have a winner’s edge to him, at least we don’t see it enough. Too often he has played us into losses with bad decisions and bad play. That has to change. On a positive note, I did see some progress at the end of the season. But this issue is still TBD.

Lastly, the narrative about the backup QB as it relates to 2020 is old and tired and completely wrong. 2019 and early 2020 Martinez had proven that he was not playing winning football from the QB position. He wasn’t getting it done. Even Frost commented on his lack of competitiveness after the 2018 season. He needed to take a seat on the bench if only to light a fire under his azz. I praise Frost for making the decision to bench Martinez. Recall that even some of his teammates publicly said Luke added a spark when he was running the offense. So it was a no brainer. Martinez needed to sit. And if you look at his performance when he returned to the starting role, it appears that the move had the intended benefit. I think he played with more intensity in the latter part of the season. Sometimes QBs benefit from a little bench time, and Martinez certainly did. My only complaint with that series of events is that I wish Frost would have put him back in late in the first half of the Illinois game, or at least the start of the second half. It was clearly needed at the time. That’s on Frost.

So, I think we’re seeing some historical revisionism in the OP. But going forward I agree that our best chance of winning in 2021 is with an improved Martinez pulling the trigger. He has to improve his mental game, and he has to improve his downfield passing (I think he will), and we need to keep him healthy. I still question how much of his issues are due to an accumulation of injuries over several years, and question whether or not his body is capable of being what we need him to be at this point. I don’t know. We had better have a plan B in place in case he’s not physically capable of being the QB we need in 2021.
Every word you type is true. The only issue missing here is that Frost has failed to get the QB with the most upside playing time. According to the yada yada yada crowd Smothers has the most upside. If that IS true then it is on Frost to get that kid into the game so that he can get experience without pressure (yes I said that) of the game being on the line. Frost is the genius and he needs to figure it out but Smothers is not going to get better riding the pine.
 

RedSaidTed

Red Shirt
The big trouble with Frost is that he has oversold everything about our program. The expectations created in his first appearances have led to disappointment of the fans through no fault of their own. I get it that we want to hear great or good news, but fake news is not the answer.
I really don’t think it matters one bit what Frost said. He could have said we’re not going to be good for years and after three losing seasons we would all be as incredibly unsatisfied as we are right now. Talk means nothing. Wins are what matters. And we don’t have em.
 

NorthwoodHusker

Travel Squad
They have had three years to learn to win. If they don’t win in 2021 it’s likely over for this staff. The fan base isn’t going to be okay with 5 losing seasons in a row, 4 in a row for this staff. And if Frost has 4 losing seasons in a row you can expect recruiting to drop off significantly. This is a make or break season for Frost and company. I think they get at least 6 wins, maybe 7 and show significant progress on the field. That’s why I think it’s critical that they have a really solid plan B at QB in the event that Martinez struggles. There is zero margin for error.
Thats not what I mean.
They didnt win under MR til they did,but still werent ready and confident.
SF has mentioned it,all coaches do, Hoiberg did the other day, its after a win, how you handle it, do you stop and just try to repeat?
The hardest thing to do once youre champs is to repeat, players have to reinvent themselves, go after any weakness in their game etc.
Winning can cause negatives as well as positives, the vast majority of these kids weent here 3 years ago.

As they say, its a process ;)
 

Red October

Junior Varsity
5 Year Member
I really don’t think it matters one bit what Frost said. He could have said we’re not going to be good for years and after three losing seasons we would all be as incredibly unsatisfied as we are right now. Talk means nothing. Wins are what matters. And we don’t have em.
I think you would be wrong, if he had said that, we would gladly would have accepted our position as a bottom feeder knowing that he would lead us up, but to misspeak created an illusion in dealing with the time needed.
 

Kwajsker

Scout Team
Often times, people's greatest regrets in the stock market involve cashing out too soon. I am hoping that is what the posters who think AM and SF aren't going to have a good year next year are doing.

I really thought this year would have a re-tooled running game with Greg Austin as run game coordinator, but our ground game never got off...the ground.

If they can find a way to get that going and have AM completing in the upper 60%s for passing I still have hope that holding on to the stock will have been the smarter opinion here. AM at his healthiest is as good as any quarterback in the league and I might be hanging on to long, but I still hope we actually see that next year with our biggest, best OL in the SF era combined with our biggest, best WR core and a bunch of hungry RB. The key term for the RB might be the word "bunch" as the numbers are there. Sorry to take a more global look than just AM as this thread describes, but it is all connected in major ways.
 

NorthwoodHusker

Travel Squad
I think you would be wrong, if he had said that, we would gladly would have accepted our position as a bottom feeder knowing that he would lead us up, but to misspeak created an illusion in dealing with the time needed.
Saying to every recruit, do you want to be a part of rebuilding Nebraska, then going out in publec and saying, its going to take years, its a no brainer.

I agree, also think we are closer than many think, and THATS what SF has said
 

solesrfr

Pura Vida!
5 Year Member
And this is precisely why I asked the question. Thanks for the civil conversation, boss.

It did not even start civil when you implied that I would be disappointed with your question. Everyone is happy when NU does well and improved QB play means NU is doing well. You were just taking a cheap dig at me like you have many times in the past. Just you being you.



C
 

goodnterribles

Regulators! Let's mount up.
5 Year Member
It did not even start civil when you implied that I would be disappointed with your question. Everyone is happy when NU does well and improved QB play means NU is doing well. You were just taking a cheap dig at me like you have many times in the past. Just you being you.



C

I was asking a serious question because you don't act like you would be happy with a successful season next year. Your own posts have made it seem that way.
 

Hville

Junior Varsity
5 Year Member
Every word you type is true. The only issue missing here is that Frost has failed to get the QB with the most upside playing time. According to the yada yada yada crowd Smothers has the most upside. If that IS true then it is on Frost to get that kid into the game so that he can get experience without pressure (yes I said that) of the game being on the line. Frost is the genius and he needs to figure it out but Smothers is not going to get better riding the pine.
Who is this yada yada yada crowd claiming Logan smothers has the most upside?
 

solesrfr

Pura Vida!
5 Year Member
I was asking a serious question because you don't act like you would be happy with a successful season next year. Your own posts have made it seem that way.

Then you missed posts or choose to only see what you want to see. You are being disingenuous and you know it.

I even posted I would be happy with .500 and your boy Crab replied that he would not be happy with .500 so maybe you should go beat him up for awhile.



C
 
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