An overlooked detail from Saturday

[Husker In Oklahoma]

What's really bad is the players know exactly what's costing them some games!! It's a credit to Chin the D keeps playing at such a high level this season because ST's have been a morale killer imo.

The players have to play better and be smarter. Clearly, there is a lack of coaching or care, with special teams, but the players have to do better. The coaches certainly don’t coach you to catch a punt at the goal line, or to kick a 10 yard punt, or to punt it to the wrong direction, or to decide to let a punt go, costing you 20-30 yards in field position. While the emphasis on coaching these guys has to improve rapidly, these players have to hold some accountability also. Some of it is just stupid, dumb, not thinking plays. You have got to use your head and be smart.

 

[the fountainhead]

I would have taken the likely yardage anyway as the extra point would been made in all probability. As I say when I’m golfing, “ the plan it was great but there’s always execution “

Hindsight is always 2020. It’s time to look forward to the Northwestern game and quit wallowing in the disappointment of last week.

 

[wcbsas]

As it's evident that Frost disregards the importance of ST, it wouldn't surprise me to find out no one on the staff had any idea how good or bad Sparty's FG kicker was. Without that info (1-2 at the range had we taken the penalty on the XP) he made the right decision, which could be the reason why he thinks his coaches are doing great.

I guess I do not understand how anyone can say he disregards the importance of STs.

Just because he doesn't have a ST-only coach doesn't mean he doesn't practice or work on STs. He has people on staff who know these things and work on them. To suggest no one on staff didn't know about the MSU kicker is silly.

The results on the field are not acceptable and SF himself would and has said that ... but we entered the season with KOY in Culp and a very experienced Punter in Przystrup. .. who would've thought - including the coaches - that both would have regressed to the level they are at? Having to play guys they were not expecting can't help the process. Who would've expect that CTB would have an aversion to catching punts?

No doubt SF and the coaches can be better ... and sometimes circumstances become perceived as excuses rather than symptoms of a problem but it is silly to suggest that SF disregards the importance of special teams ... he knows way better than you or me.

 

[Hville]

The players have to play better and be smarter. Clearly, there is a lack of coaching or care, with special teams, but the players have to do better. The coaches certainly don’t coach you to catch a punt at the goal line, or to kick a 10 yard punt, or to punt it to the wrong direction, or to decide to let a punt go, costing you 20-30 yards in field position. While the emphasis on coaching these guys has to improve rapidly, these players have to hold some accountability also. Some of it is just stupid, dumb, not thinking plays. You have got to use your head and be smart.

Aren’t the coaches supposed to mentally train them also? I can’t believe our special teams players are dumber than all the other division 1 special team players. Unless they aren’t being taught correctly.

 

[Frosty1980]

Aren’t the coaches supposed to mentally train them also? I can’t believe our special teams players are dumber than all the other division 1 special team players. Unless they aren’t being taught correctly.

I prefer to blame the coaches after four years.

 

[Beareye]

I guess I do not understand how anyone can say he disregards the importance of STs.

Just because he doesn't have a ST-only coach doesn't mean he doesn't practice or work on STs. He has people on staff who know these things and work on them. To suggest no one on staff didn't know about the MSU kicker is silly.

The results on the field are not acceptable and SF himself would and has said that ... but we entered the season with KOY in Culp and a very experienced Punter in Przystrup. .. who would've thought - including the coaches - that both would have regressed to the level they are at? Having to play guys they were not expecting can't help the process. Who would've expect that CTB would have an aversion to catching punts?

No doubt SF and the coaches can be better ... and sometimes circumstances become perceived as excuses rather than symptoms of a problem but it is silly to suggest that SF disregards the importance of special teams ... he knows way better than you or me.

The perceprton that Frost disregards STs is driven by the fact that STs have cost us numerous wins this year and in previous seasons under Frost. It's getting worse, not better, in year 4.

Maybe he really cares about STs and spends sufficient time on it in practice, but what even the casual fan can see during games is somewhere between a joke and a disaster.

 

[Hville]

The perceprton that Frost disregards STs is driven by the fact that STs have cost us numerous wins this year and in previous seasons under Frost. It's getting worse, not better, in year 4.

Maybe he really cares about STs and spends sufficient time on it in practice, but what even the casual fan can see during games is somewhere between a joke and a disaster.

I’ll add to this by saying if they are spending sufficient time on special teams than we have bad coaches.

 

[2010sAreNeverComingBack]

In his presser yesterday, HCSF mentioned a decision he had made Saturday night and none of the football media picked up on it.

Following Sparty's punt return, they were hit with a 15-yard unsportsmanlike conduct call.
Frost mentioned that he chose to enforce the penalty on the kickoff and not the extra point.
Hmmm. What an interesting decision.
Of course, it's all water under the bridge now...but...why take the yards on the kickoff when you can't return kicks worth a damn?
Why not have Sparty's kicker attempt the 35-yard extra point that was needed to tie the game?
Again, it's too bad no one in the room pressed this point as it would have been interesting to hear Scott's answer.

Nobody "picked up on it" because 99% of coaches make the same decision. I've seen that same scenario penalized countless times, and not once did a coach choose enforcement on the XP.

I understand the thought process, and wouldn't have hated it if SF did it the other way, but statistically speaking, the likely yards gained from the penalized kickoff are more valuable than the difference in likelihood of their kicker making a 20 yard kick vs a 35 yard kick.

If SF takes the penalty on the XP, the kicker makes it, and we start our next drive at the 25 (stalling out like our drive did), the same characters on this board are killing Frost for wasting the field position on a desperation, low percentage move. It's just classic hindsight. Every coaching decision is "wrong" if the players don't execute.

 

[Bleed Red]

Thank you for another example of the terrible decision making from this staff.

And yet it took until Tuesday night for the decision to be brought up as a concern?? With a few thousand arm chair coaches going over every aspect of the loss with a fine tooth comb and the fact that hindsight puts it all in perfect perspective, NOW it was a terrible decision.

As for the blocked FG...that was caused by a bad snap. The likelihood of a bad snap on a normal PAT versus a longer one would seem to be about the same. Thus, that really shouldn't factor in the decision.

 

[Bigger Ed]

I guess I do not understand how anyone can say he disregards the importance of STs.

Just because he doesn't have a ST-only coach doesn't mean he doesn't practice or work on STs. He has people on staff who know these things and work on them. To suggest no one on staff didn't know about the MSU kicker is silly.

The results on the field are not acceptable and SF himself would and has said that ... but we entered the season with KOY in Culp and a very experienced Punter in Przystrup. .. who would've thought - including the coaches - that both would have regressed to the level they are at? Having to play guys they were not expecting can't help the process. Who would've expect that CTB would have an aversion to catching punts?

No doubt SF and the coaches can be better ... and sometimes circumstances become perceived as excuses rather than symptoms of a problem but it is silly to suggest that SF disregards the importance of special teams ... he knows way better than you or me.

I don't know if the bolded is true or false. If staff is knowledgable, it isn't paying any dividends.

Kickoff Return Defense, 23.29 avg return yards, rank 97
Kickoff Return, 15 avg return yds, rank 116(T)
Net Punting, 30.95 avg yards-2 touchbacks, rank 128
Punt Return Defense, 23 avg yards, rank 130th (last)
Punt Returns, 1.14 avg yards (8 total yards in 5 games!), rank 120

Your points are valid about Culp and Przystrup but there are some ugly stats that don't involve those 2 players.

That's how I can say i don't believe this staff puts major emphasis on special teams. If they do then I have to wonder if they really do know what they're doing.

When I have time, I may do research to see if there's an actual down trend, but it sure seems like it.

 

[Husker In Oklahoma]

Aren’t the coaches supposed to mentally train them also? I can’t believe our special teams players are dumber than all the other division 1 special team players. Unless they aren’t being taught correctly.

Coaching, or lack of definitely plays a role no question. However, deciding to catch a punt at the goal line, or letting it bounce and roll 30 yards are in the players. You have to have situational awareness.

 

[Hville]

Coaching, or lack of definitely plays a role no question. However, deciding to catch a punt at the goal line, or letting it bounce and roll 30 yards are in the players. You have to have situational awareness.

I guess I’m wondering why the players on most every other team have situational awareness and ours don’t

 

[Beareye]

I’ll add to this by saying if they are spending sufficient time on special teams than we have bad coaches.

Agreed. Special Teams is either being coached poorly or not enough... possibly both.

 

[joncarl]

Non issue here. Just another thing for backseat drivers to pick apart. No one knows how anything would have played out for sure. But it is something to put away, just in case something would happen down the line.

 

[Frosty1980]