Never too early to ask. Will this be Doc's last year?

[carrolltonsker]

Kind of like the advantage Creighton has 60 miles away.

Take away the coach's son, and you have a very mediocre team. We will see what Creighton has in 1-2 years after his son goes to the NBA.

 

[p-ville husker]

Yes, they DO have something on us. Not one of them is a football school in the middle of nowhere. Every one of those schools has had more basketball tradition than Nebraska. You can bitc* and moan all you want about Doc but he's the best we've had here and don't kid yourself, NO big name coaches are banging on the door to try their hand. The word on Nebraska basketball is that it's a place that will take a monumental effort to erect and it doesn't help when so-called fans are constantly clamoring for a change.

He is nowhere close to Nee and even Collier is on par with Doc. It has nothing to do with us being a football school amazing other schools can play both sports but not the good old excuse making Huskers. None of those teams have anything on Nebraska.....Doc is a terrible recruiter and has no clue when it comes to coaching offense.

 

[p-ville husker]

Creighton is really no better than us. Their fans think so, but they play in a lower tier conference where it's much, much easier to have a special year once in a while. That's a very simplistic view. Their fans don't care that they're beating lower level teams, or don't recognize the difference. They'd be eaten alive in the Big XII or Big Ten week in and week out.

The valley is a very good conference this year but your narrow minded view will never let you see the truth.....yeah that weak arse conference kicked our butts all over the play in Kansas of all places.....but it was just another whooping, oh then we lose to Creighton this year.....Nebraska could not even finish in the top half of the Valley this year.

 

[p-ville husker]

Take away the coach's son, and you have a very mediocre team. We will see what Creighton has in 1-2 years after his son goes to the NBA.

You make no sense....you take away our best player Spencer and we are 3-6 and hardly could score 40 points a game. We are a mediocre team with Spencer with him we would be terrible.

 

[Huskers57]

I'm in the let Doc go boat....that said. I want to bring up something that has been bothering me...we have had atrocious luck in recruiting, injuries and transfers. How many have we lost due to lousy paperwork/documentation? How many have we lost for the season due to injuries? How many have transferred? If we can figure out the # from the 6 years Doc has been here, I'll bet that percentage is in the top tier compared to other schools.

 

[HuskerWeatherman]

Screw the rest of the football schools. We're talking about fielding a team here in Nebraska. You think negativity is a characteristic of a good fan? I'm going to quit this thread right there Weatherman as your mediocrity comment ticked me off. Mediocrity? I've got a weatherman talking to me about mediocrity? HA!!

I'm not quite sure what you mean by "weatherman talking to me about mediocrity." Feel free to explain, however. Nothing really ticks me off. If it was attempt to bash my profession, maybe you'd find it interesting to know my background and exactly what I do in my field. I would find it interesting to know your perception of meteorologists.

Why are you so emotionally charged over this discussion on Nebraska hoops? Lacking composure doesn't lead to a quality stance for your side of the debate. Believe me, I enjoy a good debate like few do -- and I'd enjoy you being a long-term active participant on the basketball board. The more, the merrier. I'm fine with your representing your stance. I hope you are fine in discussing further.

I don't believe I've said much negative here recently. I said last season that Doc deserves to be back. I fully expect he'll be back in 2012. But seriously -- your post that I orginally quoted was entirely about making excuses for why Nebraska and Doc shouldn't expect to be significantly better than now -- do you disagree with that? Nee was more successful. Iba was more successful. Doc is on par with Barry Collier. I like Doc more than any of those other three -- and wish he'd succeed -- but the results on the court have not been significantly better than what Barry brought us.

I've been fairly quiet this season so far -- probably the quietest I've been. I'm one of the 4 or 5 long-time regulars and originals of the hoops board (doesn't make me better, but means I've pretty much read it all at this point) -- and yes, I'm not always "rah rah" (most times, I'm not)... I used to have plenty to say, but eventually, it gets to the point where just about everything has been said a thousand times. I'm sure my discussion level will increase as we get into conference season.

No matter where you stand on the Doc issue, I'm not sure what kind of utopia you are hoping for in expecting "negative fans" to behave. The majority of Nebraskans don't give a darn either way. There's a pretty exclusive group of us who stick with Husker hoops through thick and thin -- season after season. I'm definitely not going anywhere. I'm looking foward to brighter days -- and I truly believe expectations for the program should be higher. True fans are those who are passionate enough to care -- positive or negative. There's a lot more fans that don't give a darn... might show up when something exciting happens.. but otherwise allow dust to collect on the arena seats. I might have to bring out again the dwindling attendance chart that I update annually. Fortunately, new conference teams coming to the BDSC and a new arena to follow will help boost the fannies in the seats -- but to maintain it longer-term, an improved product is imperative. I'd like to believe we are moving in the right direction. I hope we are. Some suggest each season -- for 10 years now -- that we are moving forward and the future is brighter. I'd like to believe them as it would be better for all of us.

 

[carrolltonsker]

You make no sense....you take away our best player Spencer and we are 3-6 and hardly could score 40 points a game. We are a mediocre team with Spencer with him we would be terrible.

Hmm. Makes perfect sense to me. All I am saying is that Creighton benefited greatly by choosing a coach with a son who's a great basketball player. Without him, they are not nearly as good. Why is that hard to understand?

 

[bilsker]

Hmm. Makes perfect sense to me. All I am saying is that Creighton benefited greatly by choosing a coach with a son who's a great basketball player. Without him, they are not nearly as good. Why is that hard to understand?

What he's saying is that if you take the best player off of any team that team will be worse so your original point is....pointless. That's a weak argument for why CU is better than NU.

For what it's worth, McDermott won't be leaving early for the NBA.

 

[bilsker]

Creighton is really no better than us. Their fans think so, but they play in a lower tier conference where it's much, much easier to have a special year once in a while. That's a very simplistic view. Their fans don't care that they're beating lower level teams, or don't recognize the difference. They'd be eaten alive in the Big XII or Big Ten week in and week out.

Beating lower level teams? Like Nebraska? Would CU win the Big 10? No. Would they finish last? Well, no...NU and Iowa will be battling it out for that honor. And we are talking about the current version of CU...not a CU that would look much different if it were actually IN a major confernece. You DO know the difference, right fRed? Somehow I don't think you do.

See, what fRed suffers from is a complete lack of understanding of the college basketball landscape. Right now the valley is rated 8th or 9th...out of 31 conferences. Lower tier? I guess if you have 2 tiers...the top 6 and everyone else. Of course, that would be self-serving on fRed's part. There are quite a few very good basketball teams that don't play in "BCS" conferences.

Tell me this fRed. Do you think NU has more BASKETBALL talent than CU? That's a trick question because you have to answer it with some actual knowledge of the game. I'm not talking about "athleticism" which is no less a thinly veiled euphamism than "florida speed". NU has very little quality basketball talent. Sure NU has Bo Spencer. But this guy is mostly just a shot hoarding gunner. Some games he'll light it up (like the loss to CU or the win at TCU). Other games he'll be 3-15 and NU will nearly lose to a Florida Gulf Coast or need 2 OTs to beat an absolutely awful USC team. Who else? Ubel? lol. Diaz? Has skills but he's as soft as the butter you left out on the counter last night. There are some other guys with skills that just haven't panned out. CU has a true point guard who runs the show. They have an NBA talent in McDermott. They have a guy who played for his national team. They have an increadibly savy player in Gibbs. Several snipers from the outside. Young talent that they will be bringing along (feeding the future, ya know...not one and done mercenaries).

So why can't NU get better players than creighton? BASKETBALL players. It's not necessarily facilities because CU doesn't have a fancy practice facility with ipods in every locker. They practice in a 100 year old gym. Could it be the arena? C'mon now...you don't think players will play for a crap program just for the chance to play in a big arena do you? NU struggles to get good players because they do not have a good coach. That's the main reason. You don't have to be North Carolina to field a quality basketball program in the big conferences. But why would a player come play for Doc? I won't say it's completely the crappy offense because players will go to Wisco to score 50-60 a game...but they WIN! Why come here and play disorganized crappy offense and LOSE? What fun is that?

The simple fact is Doc Sadler is not good enough to win in the Big 10. He will prove that this year. He's proven it in the Big 12 for 5 years. He will prove it again next year when NU is REBUILDING AGAIN. The man can coach defense. I'd love him for an assistant. But he's so completely clueless when it comes to offense that it negates his genius on the other end of the court. At some point you have to score. Saying "Bo...take 'em 1-on-1" is not a strategy.

 

[bilsker]

Quite right!

For years under many a coach, we brought in basketball recruits and showed them all the nice things in the football program. We really ahd nothing of substance to show a commitment to basketball. A lot of basketball recruits recognized that we weren't very commited to basketball, everthing nice went to football.

Doc pushed for all the nice things that we're finally getting. Fortunately, he had the right AD in TO who recognized exactly what he was talking about.

There's been a lot of talk about the practice facility.....none of it does justice to actually seeing it, being in it. We have a new arena coming. Our best chances to succeed are coming soon.....and Doc has had a lot to do with getting the right people to recognize these things were needed if we wanted to appear serious about upgrading our program.

We don't have a natural recruiting base as many other schools do, so we need a little something extra.

Unless everything totally collapses, Doc deserves to be able to take advantage of the practice facility as a recruiting tool. The new arena as well.

Something extra? How about a real coach. How about an opportunity to actually WIN. ipods, fancy lockers and shiny arenas don't mean squat when the player knows they will be getting their a***** handed to them on a nighly basis. God forbid a recruit comes to a game and sees Doc's impression of a basketball coach in a late game situation where NU needs some offense.

If I actually saw some semblance of coaching ability on the offensive end from the guy I might think you have a point that "the best is yet to come". But what we see on that end shows his limitation...you can't make chicken salad out of you know what. Even if he had all the right ingredients it would still taste like grool.

 

[huskerborn]

Yes, they DO have something on us. Not one of them is a football school in the middle of nowhere. Every one of those schools has had more basketball tradition than Nebraska. You can bitc* and moan all you want about Doc but he's the best we've had here and don't kid yourself, NO big name coaches are banging on the door to try their hand. The word on Nebraska basketball is that it's a place that will take a monumental effort to erect and it doesn't help when so-called fans are constantly clamoring for a change.

How far back do you have to go to create a basketball tradition? and what makes a tradition? from 1963 to 1996 Butler how zero tourney appearances ( NIT 85,91 and 92).. but from 1997 on they have been pretty good. I wouldn't call that a much of a tradition. Until we hired Collier we had a decent tradition going (if you can say Butler has one then I can say NU had one)..

 

[huskerborn]

Screw the rest of the football schools. We're talking about fielding a team here in Nebraska. You think negativity is a characteristic of a good fan? I'm going to quit this thread right there Weatherman as your mediocrity comment ticked me off. Mediocrity? I've got a weatherman talking to me about mediocrity? HA!!

Are you going to tell us how much more you know about basketball than the rest of us too?

 

[carrolltonsker]

What he's saying is that if you take the best player off of any team that team will be worse so your original point is....pointless. That's a weak argument for why CU is better than NU.

For what it's worth, McDermott won't be leaving early for the NBA.

No, what I'm saying is exactly what I said. Creighton benefited greatly from the coaching change. McDermott would have never ended up at Creighton if his father wasn't coaching there. Without McDermott, Creighton is a very mediocre team. I don't understand why that is so hard to comprehend.

 

[Porkchopexpress]

Jeez, are people still moaning on Creighton? Guys, give credit where credit is due. Creighton has built a solid program over the past 15 years. Is it Duke, UNC, Kansas, or even Wisconsin? No, but year in and year out they put a winning product on the floor, and compete. There's gotta be some sort of jealousy from some people who keep harping on Creighton. Face it, they figured out how to win consistently at the mid-major level, while NU has figured out how to be a non-factor in not one, but probably two conferences. Who cares if Creighton wouldn't win in the Big 12 or the B1G, NU can't either.

 

[huskerborn]

CU's NCAA appearances..

1941, 1962, 1964, 1974, 1975, 1978, 1981, 1989, 1991, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2007

NU's NCAA Appearances

1986, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994, 1998