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CHAOS Charles Manson, The Cia, and the Secret History of the Sixties

HUSKER HOT SAUCE

HUSKER HOT SAUCE

Be Yourself - Everyone Else Is Already Taken
10 Year Member
By Tom O'Neil with Dan Piepenbring.

Very interesting book that came out in 2019. Tom O'Neil has done some amazing sleuthing and research and some of the stuff he has uncovered is both amazing and shocking. The fact that Dennis Wilson was a friend of Manson and the family is just crazy. That Manson was trying to get recorded(and actually may have) from the Beach Boys manager is also crazy.

Also apparently, the prosecutor, Dan Bugliosi, seems to have been a total narcissistic POS who withheld real evidence and lied where he thought it would help his case. The LAPD didn't seem to care about strong evidence from the LASO(Los Angeles Sheriff's Office) and dismissed the murder of Gary Hinman as being related to the Tate-LaBianca murders.

I've still got a ways to go to finish this book, but DAYUM! It is making Helter Skelter seem like a made up joke to cover up so many wrong doings and to pad Bugliosi's pockets. Very interesting read indeed.



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I've heard good things about this book, but in my minds there is a qualifier (I doubt I'll read it but not because its not worth a read - I just have too many others lined up on my end table right now).

I was very impressed with Helter Skelter when it was published. There is a balance of sorts that has to be made between books on singular events that came out relatively quickly and those based on the same events that are published later. I don't know how to sort that out.

Earlier ones get the advantage of fresher recollections in the part of persons involved. Later ones get the advanage of more reflection, a deeper dive into what happened, but suffer from distant memory failures. I just read a bio of Chang Kai-Shek that changes a lot of beliefs about him simply because his own personal diaries have just recently been released and his view of what was going on (and facts he had that no one else had) can now be incorporated. It presents an entirerly different picture of the major players (Russia, China, communists, Kuomintang, war lords,the U.S., U.K.) than what has been incorporated in accepted history.

I think it a good idea, however, to bring this book to the attention of current readers - most wil not have read Helter Skelter anyway, and will get their view of the Manson family based on the recent movie Once Upon A Time in Hollywood.

People of this generation will get their view of the Manson group based more on this book than Helter Skelter.
 
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HUSKER HOT SAUCE said:
By Tom O'Neil with Dan Piepenbring.

Very interesting book that came out in 2019. Tom O'Neil has done some amazing sleuthing and research and some of the stuff he has uncovered is both amazing and shocking. The fact that Dennis Wilson was a friend of Manson and the family is just crazy. That Manson was trying to get recorded(and actually may have) from the Beach Boys manager is also crazy.

Also apparently, the prosecutor, Dan Bugliosi, seems to have been a total narcissistic POS who withheld real evidence and lied where he thought it would help his case. The LAPD didn't seem to care about strong evidence from the LASO(Los Angeles Sheriff's Office) and dismissed the murder of Gary Hinman as being related to the Tate-LaBianca murders.

I've still got a ways to go to finish this book, but DAYUM! It is making Helter Skelter seem like a made up joke to cover up so many wrong doings and to pad Bugliosi's pockets. Very interesting read indeed.



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Haven’t read the book. I guess I thought it was a pretty well known fact that Dennis Wilson for a time was Friendly with Manson.

I have also seen interviews with Mike Love and he says he even met Manson once at Dennis Wilson’s house.
 
EastOfEden said:
I've heard good things about this book, but in my minds there is a qualifier (I doubt I'll read it but not because its not worth a read - I just have too many others lined up on my end table right now).

I was very impressed with Helter Skelter when it was published. There is a balance of sorts that has to be made between books on singular events that came out relatively quickly and those based on the same events that are published later. I don't know how to sort that out.

Earlier ones get the advantage of fresher recollections in the part of persons involved. Later ones get the advanage of more reflection, a deeper dive into what happened, but suffer from distant memory failures. I just read a bio of Chang Kai-Shek that changes a lot of beliefs about him simply because his own personal diaries have just recently been released and his view of what was going on (and facts he had that no one else had) can now be incorporated. It presents an entirerly different picture of the major players (Russia, China, communists, Kuomintang, war lords,the U.S., U.K.) than what has been incorporated in accepted history.

I think it a good idea, however, to bring this book to the attention of current readers - most wil not have read Helter Skelter anyway, and will get their view of the Manson family based on the recent movie Once Upon A Time in Hollywood.

People of this generation will get their view of the Manson group based more on this book than Helter Skelter.
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Nicely stated. I have been enjoying reading this so far. It's amazing to me how many Hollywood stars or elites, were either directly or indirectly involved in this in one way or another. So many people refused to make any comments at all, whether out of fear from "The family" or whether out of fear of self incriminating themselves from just partying with Manson and his zombies.

I understand the maybe not going to read it part, as I too, have a ton of books I want to read, but this one is on loan from a coworker and I need to get it back to him. It's been a page turner so far. As I stated, it's very interesting the stuff I didn't know. I was a toddler when this all took place, but I still find it absolutely interesting.
 



NUinID said:
Haven’t read the book. I guess I thought it was a pretty well known fact that Dennis Wilson for a time was Friendly with Manson.

I have also seen interviews with Mike Love and he says he even met Manson once at Dennis Wilson’s house.
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I was never really a fan of the Beach Boys( like a song or two) and of course I was really young when it all went down. I just didn't realize it, but I'm sure somewhere in the past I heard about Dennis being a good friend of Manson and partying with his followers. I just didn't know that he allowed them to stay at his place and he would stay with them at the ranch. I think that that Bugliosi was as big a criminal as anyone else involved in this case, and that is a shocker to me.

Just like all the Kennedy theories on who shot and killed him, we more than likely will never know the truest facts and the actual reason behind his assassination in full view of the entire world. I'll watch or read any and every new show or book on the subject. This is worth the read so far, as I'm about halfway through it. I'd say read it if you've got the time.
 
HUSKER HOT SAUCE said:
I was never really a fan of the Beach Boys( like a song or two) and of course I was really young when it all went down. I just didn't realize it, but I'm sure somewhere in the past I heard about Dennis being a good friend of Manson and partying with his followers. I just didn't know that he allowed them to stay at his place and he would stay with them at the ranch. I think that that Bugliosi was as big a criminal as anyone else involved in this case, and that is a shocker to me.

Just like all the Kennedy theories on who shot and killed him, we more than likely will never know the truest facts and the actual reason behind his assassination in full view of the entire world. I'll watch or read any and every new show or book on the subject. This is worth the read so far, as I'm about halfway through it. I'd say read it if you've got the time.
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I think Manson and his "Family" hung out at Wilson's house for a couple of weeks. I think they were "friends for a couple of months" and then he wised up.

Sounds like this author is trying to paint Manson and his followers a little sympathetically. I guess I don't understand what the author is trying to prove. Tex Watson, Leslie van Houton, Pat Krenwinkle have all admitted to the crimes. I don't know what the angle is.
 
NUinID said:
Sounds like this author is trying to paint Manson and his followers a little sympathetically.
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Not even close to what he is doing. In fact, he isn't painting anyone involved sympathetically at all, he has been researching for years on years, trying to figure out what really happened and why. As the title suggests, there were a lot of people involved in this, including government spies if you will, before the murders ever took place.

Either way, I am finding it completely fascinating to read. As I think you know, there are always more than just two sides to a story, and one as complicated as this one was/is, I respect his research, his time consuming dedication to finding out all he could, to his writing skills.

If anyone thinks that they know all there is to know about this case, they are fooling themselves. As I mentioned about the Kennedy assassination, there are so many half truths and straight up lies, that 99.999% of the world will never truly know the actual truth to what and more importantly, why, these tragic, polarizing events occurred. Fascinating read for me, your mileage may vary.
 
Don’t bring the Dead and Jerry into this.. lol

Beach Boys were well know with CM.

Hendrix, well you can read about it
 




EastOfEden said:
I've heard good things about this book, but in my minds there is a qualifier (I doubt I'll read it but not because its not worth a read - I just have too many others lined up on my end table right now).

I was very impressed with Helter Skelter when it was published. There is a balance of sorts that has to be made between books on singular events that came out relatively quickly and those based on the same events that are published later. I don't know how to sort that out.

Earlier ones get the advantage of fresher recollections in the part of persons involved. Later ones get the advanage of more reflection, a deeper dive into what happened, but suffer from distant memory failures. I just read a bio of Chang Kai-Shek that changes a lot of beliefs about him simply because his own personal diaries have just recently been released and his view of what was going on (and facts he had that no one else had) can now be incorporated. It presents an entirerly different picture of the major players (Russia, China, communists, Kuomintang, war lords,the U.S., U.K.) than what has been incorporated in accepted history.

I think it a good idea, however, to bring this book to the attention of current readers - most wil not have read Helter Skelter anyway, and will get their view of the Manson family based on the recent movie Once Upon A Time in Hollywood.

People of this generation will get their view of the Manson group based more on this book than Helter Skelter.
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I'm curious what the book is that you're reading about Chiang?
 
HUSKER HOT SAUCE said:
As I mentioned about the Kennedy assassination, there are so many half truths and straight up lies, that 99.999% of the world will never truly know the actual truth to what and more importantly, why, these tragic, polarizing events occurred. Fascinating read for me, your mileage may vary.
Click to expand...

I have to admit that I'm one of the 0.001%. On a related note, I may or may not have been on the grassy knoll on November 22, 1963.
 
Read Hollywood Eden: Electric Guitars, Fast Cars, and the Myth of the California Paradise by Joel Selvin to see how intertwined the musicians were in the early sixties, including the number of graduates from University High (just outside UCLA) Class of 59, led by Jan of Jan and Dean--Manson is mentioned. Fascinating stories about the song "Eve of Destruction", kidnapping of Frank Sinatra Jr., and on and on.
 




HUSKER HOT SAUCE said:
By Tom O'Neil with Dan Piepenbring.

Very interesting book that came out in 2019. Tom O'Neil has done some amazing sleuthing and research and some of the stuff he has uncovered is both amazing and shocking. The fact that Dennis Wilson was a friend of Manson and the family is just crazy. That Manson was trying to get recorded(and actually may have) from the Beach Boys manager is also crazy.

Also apparently, the prosecutor, Dan Bugliosi, seems to have been a total narcissistic POS who withheld real evidence and lied where he thought it would help his case. The LAPD didn't seem to care about strong evidence from the LASO(Los Angeles Sheriff's Office) and dismissed the murder of Gary Hinman as being related to the Tate-LaBianca murders.

I've still got a ways to go to finish this book, but DAYUM! It is making Helter Skelter seem like a made up joke to cover up so many wrong doings and to pad Bugliosi's pockets. Very interesting read indeed.



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I listened to it on audio book. Vincent Bugliosi is a narcissist, Lying POS. Not saying that Charlie was innocent.

@cactusboy, what's your thoughts?
 
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