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Thread: N2FL Calls Lester Ward and Steven Osborne Recruiting Misses ???

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by N2FL View Post
    I'm sorry guys like you and YUENGLING feel that way. The fact is, I have never paid to subscribe to a recruiting service, and the website I used to contribute to was 100% free as well. Just wondering though...how are people getting 'fleeced' by recruiting sites? You are paying money to post opinions here right? Both parties know what they are paying for.I have never called myself a recruitnik or guru. I do however sometimes get compensated by people for my analysis and opinions, so I guess you got me there.
    It's funny how some want to discredit those who use a certain action as a career or in their job, yet believe that same actions is worth more weight when they use it on a forum among miscellaneous posters of professions that don't require that action.

    I appreciate you, RR, and others for the professional and/or non professional opinions you share on this board and hope it continues. No matter if I agree or disagree, you provide great insight and discussion on the recruits and/or commits.
    Quote Originally Posted by Pops View Post
    Well look at this! it is true..when one loses one sense..in this case a sense of humor, the other senses are heightened...In this case, a sense of self importance

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by boiler_husker View Post
    +1

    As mostly a lurker I read Max mainly for information. Great to get it from people who have some knowledge. Thanks N2FL
    You're welcome.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by wcbsas View Post
    It is just semantics ... but I disagree with the statement "have not earned their scholarship".

    That is not a statement for you or any other recruiting guru to make ... that evaluation is up to Pelini and his staff. There is much more that goes on to being a member of the football team. Sometimes it is luck, opportunity and happenstance as much as it is to skill and effort if an athlete is able to make a contribution on the field on Saturday's.

    Have these guys met or exceeded expectations 3+ years ago when they were signed? Probably not, likely even by their own admission. I would be interested in anyone finding any recruiting class where the vast majority of the athletes met or exceeded expectations.

    For all we know each of the guys listed showed up every day, practiced hard, are good citizens, progressed towards their degrees, are good teammates and are proud to be part of the Husker family.
    I want to start by saying I am not a fan of what the SEC does and just ripping a scholarship from a kid to make room for someone else. I also want to say that I can relate to a coach who wants to get rid of a kid who he knows is not doing what he needs to do to become a better player. Whether that is not learning the playbook, working out as vigorously, hustling in practice, late to meetings, etc. Not taking away the scholarship to make sure you can sign more kids, but to remove some kids that are not earning their scholarship.

    When I say earning their scholarship, I am comparing an 'athletic' scholarship to an 'academic' one. Follow my logic...

    When a university grants a student an academic scholarship, they expect that student to maintain the same outstanding classroom performance in college that the student displayed in High School. They dont take into account that college is more difficult, a huge step up in course work and expectations. They expect that kid to earn his scholarship every semester, its not a 4-year given after they receive it in HS. They are still expected to maintain a higher GPA than average students are. Those are the benefits of attending for free. If a kid has a 3.8 GPA in HS and now is getting a 2.3 in college, that is not acceptable.

    Now look at that with athletes. They get sholarships with the expectation of giving 100% to the team and becoming the best players they can be. They also know that only a select few are doing that for free. They know they are expected to contribute in some way on the field on gamedays. With as much scrutiny as coaches are under to 'win now', of course they are going to want to make sure those '85' scholarships are being utilized. They cant be used by players who are just great teammates and practice players. Not with the 85 limit. Before 1991 it was 95, maybe then. Now they need to be distributed properly.

    I dont like the idea of cutting 5 players a year who are not what you want them to be. But if 1 or 2 a year (if that) have been in your program for 3 or so years and continue to dog it, I can see where a coach would feel some sense to better his program.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Zeppelin View Post
    I wouldn't call Micah Kreikemeier a miss. He was recruited for another reason, not necessarily to play football.
    I wasn't a fan of the Kreikemeier offer - - or at least not the timing of it (Osborne should have waited for Pelini to make it) - - but to be fair to the guy he has been injured pretty much his entire career at NU.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Howl View Post
    I wasn't a fan of the Kreikemeier offer - - or at least not the timing of it (Osborne should have waited for Pelini to make it) - - but to be fair to the guy he has been injured pretty much his entire career at NU.
    I'm surprised he wasn't a medical already. Any further setbacks and I'm guessing he might end up one. Too bad, I was hoping he'd get healthy and we'd at least see if he could compete for the depth chart.
    "Just because somebody's a talented guy or he's right for a lot of people
    doesn't mean he's right for us here at Nebraska." -Bo Pelini, 2/3/10


  6. #46
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    If a scholarship is dogging it as N2FL says ( not showing up or late for meetings, poor class attendance or lack of effort at any time) I agree the scholarship should be pulled as the player is not earning ( according to the coach) his scholarship.
    N2FL ...do you have any information that any of these players were dogging it and deserve to lose their scholarship? If not It's my opinion that none of the players mentioned by you in your posts should have the worth of their contribtition to the team questioned in any way.

    If Ron Brown says Mr. Gilleylen is the kind of kid "you go to war with" and holds him up as an example of an ultimate player that's good enough for me. I will continue to have that opinion of him and the others you claim didn't earn their scholarship until the coaches tell me otherwise.
    "My job as a football coach is to educate and prepare the kids who come into this program for the rest of their life..." Bo Pelini at the Penn State post game press conference Nov. 12 2011

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by N2FL View Post
    I want to start by saying I am not a fan of what the SEC does and just ripping a scholarship from a kid to make room for someone else. I also want to say that I can relate to a coach who wants to get rid of a kid who he knows is not doing what he needs to do to become a better player. Whether that is not learning the playbook, working out as vigorously, hustling in practice, late to meetings, etc. Not taking away the scholarship to make sure you can sign more kids, but to remove some kids that are not earning their scholarship.

    When I say earning their scholarship, I am comparing an 'athletic' scholarship to an 'academic' one. Follow my logic...

    When a university grants a student an academic scholarship, they expect that student to maintain the same outstanding classroom performance in college that the student displayed in High School. They dont take into account that college is more difficult, a huge step up in course work and expectations. They expect that kid to earn his scholarship every semester, its not a 4-year given after they receive it in HS. They are still expected to maintain a higher GPA than average students are. Those are the benefits of attending for free. If a kid has a 3.8 GPA in HS and now is getting a 2.3 in college, that is not acceptable.

    Now look at that with athletes. They get sholarships with the expectation of giving 100% to the team and becoming the best players they can be. They also know that only a select few are doing that for free. They know they are expected to contribute in some way on the field on gamedays. With as much scrutiny as coaches are under to 'win now', of course they are going to want to make sure those '85' scholarships are being utilized. They cant be used by players who are just great teammates and practice players. Not with the 85 limit. Before 1991 it was 95, maybe then. Now they need to be distributed properly.

    I dont like the idea of cutting 5 players a year who are not what you want them to be. But if 1 or 2 a year (if that) have been in your program for 3 or so years and continue to dog it, I can see where a coach would feel some sense to better his program.
    I understand what you are saying ... in fact I'm a fan of the NFL re-draft what-if scenario's ... i.e. redoing the draft 5 years after everything plays out.

    Recruiting is not so easy. Plus I would argue Pelini would tell you some of the guys you listed were great team players. Plus the assumption is that a JT Kerr would've been replaced by an athlete who wanted to come to NU - not always a good assumption.
    The life you lead is the life you teach!

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by YUENGLING View Post
    If a scholarship is dogging it as N2FL says ( not showing up or late for meetings, poor class attendance or lack of effort at any time) I agree the scholarship should be pulled as the player is not earning ( according to the coach) his scholarship.
    N2FL ...do you have any information that any of these players were dogging it and deserve to lose their scholarship? If not It's my opinion that none of the players mentioned by you in your posts should have the worth of their contribtition to the team questioned in any way.

    If Ron Brown says Mr. Gilleylen is the kind of kid "you go to war with" and holds him up as an example of an ultimate player that's good enough for me. I will continue to have that opinion of him and the others you claim didn't earn their scholarship until the coaches tell me otherwise.
    In Okafor's case, there's a lot of ammo to support him 'not earning it' from a performance standpoint. According to someone on another board closer to the situation, he has poor habits/hasn't put in the work (weight room/practice) and did nothing to try and become a contributor (e.g ST's, refused position change). If Ron Brown couldn't motivate him, then I don't know what to say.
    "Just because somebody's a talented guy or he's right for a lot of people
    doesn't mean he's right for us here at Nebraska." -Bo Pelini, 2/3/10


  9. #49
    In theory, I can agree with N2FL... I note a lot of the msses in 2008 and 2009 were Not Ranked by recruiting services...

    However, looking back, say 2007 for example, Eric Hagg and Marcel Jones (NR by scout) show up as not ranked. Mendoza was #12 of Rivals but much lower on Scout... Cally told Q that Mendoza wasn't an every down back (did he think he had the potential to be a Darrin Sproles?). Helu was ranked 55 & 86. Q was #2 & #8...

    As I said in 2008, neither of the Osbornes were ranked, nor was Ward (actually a low ranking on Scout) or Kreickemier (and I agree, surprised he hasn't gone medical). Same with Mason Wald and Marlowe. Antionio Bell finally showed up in 2009, but he was not ranked by either service in 2008 when he first signed. Gilleylen was unranked by Scout (his problem was a lack of hands above all else)

    2009, Qvale was the only part not ranked.

    2010 it is a bit early, the only NRs by both services are Jake Cotton & Bronson Marsh. Several of the Nebraska HS signees were NR by scout.

    Bottom line, there is a correlation between being ranked and a contributor, but it isn't absolute. We have had some pretty good signees who weren't ranked and some highly ranked ones that didn't work out for a variety of reasons.

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by YUENGLING View Post
    How do young men like Lester Ward and Steven Osborne get called recruiting misses by N2FL after spending four years on the Husker team. Lester Ward played behind Roy Helu ( NFL all Rookie) and Rex Burkhead ( destined to become a legend at Nebraska). The young man competed, never complained, agreed to move to TE this season (a position he never played) and did nothing but work hard on and off the field.

    Steven Osborne, a 2011 Brooke Berringer Team member has also worked hard without complaining and certainly is an asset to this team. I'm not sure he's on the two deep but he'll be back and working hard and pushing for playing time for a fifth year.


    As a fan I am extermely proud of these two Huskers who did everything the coaches asked and more. Playing four years for Nebraska and earning a degree is something to be proud of and most Husker fans would agree. There's more to the team than the two deep roster and as a high school player and coach I realize both of these young men were important members of the team.

    You owe both Ward and Osborne an apology. Your comments are way out of line and suggest they didn't deserve or earn their scholarships.
    I'd like to see your credentials. Did you ever see the inside of a locker room ? Where and when did you play? At what level ? Where do you get your expertise?
    Mr. Sensitive party of one, your table is ready.

  11. #51
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    I don't think any staff in the country recruits a kid to say "I bet he will be a dynamo on the scout team". I don't think N2FL is saying anything negative about the kids themselves other than the fact that the staff recruited them to make an impact on game day and for whatever reason they just didn't. I have to agree with most that they were misses.




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